Russian-based non-domain TM squatter

[sasquatch]

"By Alex Rodriguez
Tribune foreign correspondent
Published November 1, 2005

MOSCOW -- The Russian capital's love affair with lattes and cappuccinos has been squarely in the sights of Seattle-based Starbucks for years. So why hasn't a city with a gold mine of a coffee-lover market seen its first Starbucks?

An enterprising Muscovite named Sergei Zuykov can explain.

During Russia's financial crisis in 1998, Zuykov's car alarms dealership was foundering, so he poured his money into acquiring the Russian rights to foreign trademarks. Then, for the right price, he sold the rights to the companies that had established those trademarks elsewhere in the world, effectively forcing them to pay a toll for using their own corporate identities in Russia.

Intellectual property rights advocates say the practice amounts to blackmail; Zuykov calls it a simple case of exercising initiative..."

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/...10141nov01,1,1593508.story?ctrack=1&cset=true

 

[darrenl]

Can't view the article, can you post it maybe?

 

[sasquatch]

"...Zuykov, who said he owned roughly 300 brands in addition to Starbucks, is merely the best known of what trademark lawyers say are a dozen or so individuals and companies active in hoarding brand names and patents in Russia. While authorities are clamping down on street vendors selling knockoff Nikes and bootleg DVDs, these legal pirates have thrived..."

www.iht.com/articles/2005/10/12/business/starbucks.php

Or alternatively, just google his name.

 

[StockDoctor]

Sergei Zuykov Just another slimeball squatter who cares more about ripping of some cash from a TM holder than he is in the welfare of his own country.

Better enforcement of intellectual property rights is seen as a requirement for Russia's long-awaited entry into the World Trade Organization late this year or early next year.

 

[labrocca]

Well if it's legal in his country to do this then is he really a scumbag? How many of you would do the same thing if in his position?

 

[StockDoctor]

Well if it's legal in his country to do this then is he really a scumbag?

Yeah he's a scumbag. I don't care if he lives in Botswanna-wetland el shaba ali baba, and I don't care if he doesn't have any laws per se in some frickin backward country. If he knows enough to steal famous marks, the guy is living off the hard work and goodwill of someone other than himself. You're a moderator here and you can't see that, or are you just making conversation and playing devil's advocate?

How many of you would do the same thing if in his position?

I'd like to know how many members we really have on this forum that think it's ok to ripoff somebody else's work for their own personal gain as well. Man this is really getting bad. What's gonna be ok on this board next? Nothing wrong with spyware or Keyloggers right?

 

[Bender]

thread cleaned.
Everyone is entitled to an opinion about this issue, but please do not attack other members, no matter what they believe.

 

[labrocca]

Yeah he's a scumbag. I don't care if he lives in Botswanna-wetland el shaba ali baba, and I don't care if he doesn't have any laws per se in some frickin backward country. If he knows enough to steal famous marks, the guy is living off the hard work and goodwill of someone other than himself. You're a moderator here and you can't see that, or are you just making conversation and playing devil's advocate? I'd like to know how many members we really have on this forum that think it's ok to ripoff somebody else's work for their own personal gain as well. Man this is really getting bad. What's gonna be ok on this board next? Nothing wrong with spyware or Keyloggers right?

A little upset are we? I didn't say it was right but at the same time if it's legal to smoke marijuana in Amsterdam does that give Americans the right to call them scumbags? You are calling the individual a derogatory name. I would like to think that his COUNTRY is the problem with it's poor intellectual property laws. The person seems to just be working in his system. I am really not sure what gives Starbucks or McDonalds (both US companies) an exclusive right to those names OUTSIDE the USA. If Russia has relaxed rules about the names and their usage then that's a policy/law problem. In the USA we have similar laws as well in state-to-state. If I name my Corporation Jones Smith Corp in Iowa then someone could register that corporation in California. I really don't see why you are so upset over this. If these major billion dollar companies really see this as a problem they will do as they always do. Get lawyers, lobbyists, and pay off the officials to get laws changed in their favor. This has worked here for them. Seems like they have new and unchartered territory to enter now. I can't really care about Starbucks not being able to use their name in Russia...they can easily just call themselves another name. I really don't see that big a deal here. You throw around the words scumbag and thief but I don't see how they apply here to this person.


Maybe you can calm done some and debate the topic instead of going off on a tirade.

 

[StockDoctor]

Labrocca To clarify, what I'm against is the action of someone intentionally ripping off profits from someone else's work and good will. To me that makes them a theif and a scumbag. No tirade involved.

In this case above, this guy is not only intentionally ripping off profits from someone else who worked for it, he's also hurting his own country's acceptance into modern trade. An anology would be if some guy came to your house and stole your car, took off to Ali Baba el Baloneyta (who have no laws against him stealing your car) and I guess that would then make it OK.

What does make me upset is when I tell someone I'm a "Domainer" and they say something like they "don't think cybersquatting is ok". That label (and the stink that goes with it) is caused by the squatters (including members here) that have no qualms about the misdirection of traffic and the theft of revenue. I'm sure some of the same people are the ones plying us with spyware, malware, spam and keylooging as well. If they can make a buck it's ok.

 

[Dale Hubbard]

It's time the word 'slimeball' went into the database of words to be masked here -- I'm sick of seeing that ^&$%.

And I thought that last word would be masked. Had to do it myself.

 

[Bender]

Labrocca To clarify, what I'm against is the action of someone intentionally ripping off profits from someone else's work and good will. To me that makes them a theif and a scumbag. No tirade involved.

I agree with you 100%.
In my country a company registered the mark "Vodafone", a few years ago,forcing Vodafone to sue them in order to enter the market.

An anology would be if some guy came to your house and stole your car, took off to Ali Baba el Baloneyta (who have no laws against him stealing your car) and I guess that would then make it OK.

that's not an analogy.In your case the crime happened on a country that punishes it.

 

[Dave Zan]

Boys, behave. :-D

 

[StockDoctor]

I agree with you 100%.
In my country a company registered the mark "Vodafone", a few years ago,forcing Vodafone to sue them in order to enter the market. that's not an analogy. In your case the crime happened on a country that punishes it.

Yeah you're right, but you get the drift. Just because some backward country doesn't have laws against something that is just plain "wrong" doesn't make it ok. I first saw this type of crap during the info sunrise, when some set up trademarks in Countries that had NO restrictions on generic words.Then the rest of the world had to "honor" their trumped up biz? People should be guided by a little sense of what's "right", not just by what they can get away with.

 

[Sarcle]

People should be guided by a little sense of what's "right", not just by what they can get away with.

Maybe someone needs to fill Bill Gates in on this then.

 

[Dale Hubbard]

Quite so Sarcle. And I would have left out the "...on this then" part. He's one of the world's worst profligates. I totally agree with your sentiments. This whole typo/cyber/squatter thing seems to me to be a matter of real inconsequence. I fail to see why it's been dragged around everywhere here. Everyone does it by all accounts, even those that take a supreme moral high ground and keep battering the matter to death. Boring.

"Pays your money, takes your goods".

 

[StockDoctor]

Maybe someone needs to fill Bill Gates in on this then.

Agree. But Gates already knows this and doesn't care. This guy is a hero to plenty of people. He would have been to me too, but for the really bad (monopolistic) crap his company has pulled. Wouldn't you think he could just take a few $Billion less to stay a righteous dude?

That's how I see some of the "top" guys in the "url" business. Did they have to resort to TM squatting and ripping off someone else to do it? Hell, anybody could do that. Rather, I admire others who excelled by hard work, without taking the low road.

 

[labrocca]

I just think you are targetting the wrong guy StocDoctor. You should be saying "screw russia and it's terrible laws". You don't blame individuals for a governments mistakes. In this day and age you should realize that. I just can't help to feel that we don't know this person and calling him names just simply isn't professional sounding imho. You appear to be very vocal lately about squatting and using some words that imho are inappropriate. I understand your view and can even agree with some of it. I am really NOT a fan of PPC or squatting on names to force money out of a company. But I recognize that each person has their own sense of boundaries. These are domains...no one is killing each other over it.

I still would like to hear why you feel that in Russia they have to recognize a US corporations trademark. I just don't see it.

 

[Dale Hubbard]

There is no possible justification for correlating Russian law with US law. Is Russia a signatory to any TM or copyright convention? Of course not -- and in reality, why should they be? It's "dog eat dog" in many countries. Semantics of domain registration are not high on the political agenda. ICANN is the only body that could have a say in this, but that's another story. The internet as we know it today is still a free-for-all with plenty of greedy officialdom. You only have to look at the 'phenomenon' of 'drops' and evaluate what's going on there to get my drift. GREED RULES. That's basic economics.

 

[StockDoctor]

There is no possible justification for correlating Russian law with US law. Is Russia a signatory to any TM or copyright convention? Of course not -- and in reality, why should they be?

The problem as I see it is that domains are without boundary. Why would it be ok for some guy like this to squat on McDonalds for example and hold it for ransom, but the same guy could file a TM in whatever country that allows it and then restrict me from using the term? It's the double standard that I think stinks. It's the finding the Country with the lowest standards and using them to restrict usage in the countries of higher standards. In this global marketing world, there should be just 1 trademark database and just 1 patent database imho.

 

[Dale Hubbard]

Well, that's utopia Stoc. Nice premise, but totally unworkable in this millenium I fear, as far as domain names are concerned.