Shrewd Idea... Buying Local Business Names ?

[AtTheLake]

Okay I understand I will likely take some heat for asking the question; and maybe it has been asked before?

I am a Maintenance Man by day and interact with hundreds of people weekly, so this is probably where this idea stemed from. I have been studying domaining for a couple months now and have spent many hours and long nights reading DNForum and other material as well and have came to the realization this business is a bit tougher than appears on the surface. (LIKE EVERYTHING INVOLVING MONEY) :-/ That doesn't reflect my thoughts about the next question though. I am simply wondering/hypotheticals about anyone doing this or experiences. (not saying I am doing this or will)

Like i said I visit with many people a week and deal with many large and small businesses a week. I have noticed maybe 40-60% have some type of web presence (10-20% something good.. cause i look them up and the remaining very low budget website), be it their own website or "worse" general information about their business that is on google page 1 from another web provider of sorts. about employees, address, phone # etc.

My question is... How shrewd would it be to register some of the businesses domain name's and try to strike a deal with them??

I would like opinions on if some of you do this or not?

Some of these businesses have been in business a long time (10-40 years) and some don't have a website or domain; as they are run by typically a white male in his 50-60's that is not tech savy. Some of these businesses likely bring in 300K-1.5MM in revenue each year and it amazes me they don't even have a website.

I don't want to register their name and then blackmail them for cash or anything of that nature; but if I was to register the name and then inform them... Hey I wana give this to you to help protect your business, while your at it if you could ever do me a favor don't forget the favor ??? Just curious...

 

[Bill F.]

My first thought is that it might negatively impact your maintenance work. Why not just cold call businesses that you're not doing maintenance for first?

The other thing is, if you register actual company names, you're likely to get some hostile reactions even if you offer to give them to the company. Others will simply not be interested - if they didn't want the name when Godaddy was selling it why would they want it when their maintenance man is offering it?

Even in the best case, where they accept the name as a gift, what the heck is a favor? Sounds like Marlon Brando in the Godfather. It's vague, and a bit intimidating, depending on how you present it. If you want an action on their part, you need to be clear about it. The most obvious would be to offer to develop their website and do basic SEO for it. If you want to strike a deal, you need to be clear with yourself about what exactly you want and why it's in their interests to work with you.

Why not start where you are? Build a top ranked website to promote your maintenance business, then offer to do the same for others (if you're not satisfied with making a bundle doing maintenance - I know 2 people in different continents who got rich that way).

Just giving a name to someone who has zero appreciation for the power of the net is like giving prize Kobe beef to a vegan. They're not going to change their habits just because it's there, and they might resent the intrusion. In either case, the beef will be wasted.

 

[hugegrowth]

I think it would just irritate and confuse those people if you registered the domain first, and most of them would look at you awkwardly. If you want to help them out, it would be better to suggest the idea to them and let them register it themselves.

 

[britishbulldog]

Most people especially small businesses just dont get domains and how it can impact their brand...

 

[draggar]

So if there is a business you did work for, Pet Supplies R Us and you registered petsuppliesrus.com and then offered to sell it to them?

Isn't that cybersquatting and what gives the rest of us a bad name?

 

[Jeroen]

When you are registering local business names, they better be generic like discussed in DNF college.

Stuff like BostonPlumber.com, SeattleLawyer.com, etc

 

[katherine]

I think you are going to accumulate worthless domains.

If the end users in question don't even have an online presence in 2012 that means they won't even get the point of owning a domain name.
You will spend a lot of time providing them with free education for meager results.

If they have some sort of website but low quality it also means they don't take their online presence seriously.
They are not good candidates for buying domain names.
Small fry thinks small.

 

[Biggie]

If you want to help them out, it would be better to suggest the idea to them and let them register it themselves.

unless you want to take on a "webmaster role or tech admin" for them, should they go for the idea of a website or just a simple webpage.

 

[INFORG]

unless you want to take on a "webmaster role or tech admin" for them, should they go for the idea of a website or just a simple webpage.

^^^This is a viable model. register the domain, put up a decent info site that generates leads, add to Google directory, create a Facebook page. Contact the business owner and tell them you are starting a web development business and putting up "free" sites. Explain how people now look to the web before the yellow pages (I'd specifically target businesses that pay to be in the yellow pages). Tell them if they like it, and are happy with the results, you can manage the whole thing for $XX a year and they don't have to do anything.

You are unlikely to be seen as cybersquatting scum under this plan, and only a few scenarios can develop - most with positive or neutral end results.

 

[silentg]

Start your own web design company and help these businesses come online.

 

[David G]

....If the end users in question don't even have an online presence in 2012 that means they won't even get the point of owning a domain name. You will spend a lot of time providing them with free education for meager results.....

Been there and done that several times with local business people. Last time was when parking next to a local window cleaners SUV in a parking lot seeing his magnetic sign which did not have a URl but just a phone number. Later on ran into him in person and when I mentioned too bad you did not have a website so I could have contacted you there he said why did you not call my number? I explained did not have a pen with me and could not recall a phone number but could have remembeed a URL such as citynamewindowcleaners.com he still could care less about having a website and said he did not need one. After telling him he could have made $250 just with my job alone if he had a url (but I had hired someone else) he still had zero interest. I no longer bother to educate poeple like that.

 

[AtTheLake]

I appreciate all the insight you guys offered here. I surely don't want it to impact the work that I do what so ever, thinking about it more I can very well see how it might be somewhat akward coming from myself given the tenant / maintenance perspective. And I do take slight offense to anyone suggesting that my intentions are to cyber squat; as they are not! I am simply a giving and helpful person i only thought of it in the light of I could possibly help someone else and then maybe later they could help me possibly. But probably the best point being that if they haven't gotten on the web by now, thats probably because they don't want to. I certainly don't want to waste my time trying to inform an individual that does't care... Cheers All

 

[draggar]

And I do take slight offense to anyone suggesting that my intentions are to cyber squat; as they are not! I am simply a giving and helpful person i only thought of it in the light of I could possibly help someone else and then maybe later they could help me possibly. But probably the best point being that if they haven't gotten on the web by now, thats probably because they don't want to. I certainly don't want to waste my time trying to inform an individual that does't care... Cheers All

The definition of a Cyber-squatter:

Cybersquatting (also known as domain squatting), according to the United States federal law known as the Anticybersquatting Consumer Protection Act, is registering, trafficking in, or using a domain name with bad faith intent to profit from the goodwill of a trademark belonging to someone else. The cybersquatter then offers to sell the domain to the person or company who owns a trademark contained within the name at an inflated price.

You asked...

My question is... How shrewd would it be to register some of the businesses domain name's and try to strike a deal with them??

...

I don't want to register their name and then blackmail them for cash or anything of that nature; but if I was to register the name and then inform them... Hey I wana give this to you to help protect your business, while your at it if you could ever do me a favor don't forget the favor ??? Just curious...

So you're asking if it is OK to register someone else's business name and then either "strike a deal" with them or give them the name "for a favor".

If we're talking about generics (plumber.com) or geo + generic (bostonplumber.com) that's one thing but if you're talking about registering BobandSonsPlumbing.com and then going to "Bob and Sons Plumbing" that's just the same as registering MicrosoftOffice.com and then offering to sell to to Bill Gates. You are looking to profit off of the work that someone else has done.

If you act as a consultant and say "Hey, by the way, BobandSonsPlumbing.com is available to register, it would be a great domain for your business" and they ask you to register it for them that's on thing - you're being reactive and will have their permission to get it for them (get it in writing). Even if they go ahead and register it themselves you have shown to them that you are an honest person and they may come to you for web design, email set up, hosting, and so on.

Doing it the other way, registering first and then going to them will get you on the wrong end of a WIPO eventually and labeled as a cyber-squatter. One does not need a trademark to have the rights to a name, by registering it and then going to them about it is proof that you are aware of their business name and registered the business name with the intention to sell it for a profit or otherwise benefit from it.

IMO being preemptive with this is not a good idea. Eventually you'll end up defending your actions in court.

 

[AtTheLake]

appreciate the advice Draggar its probably unnecessary at this point as I will just mind my own business and not suggest advice to anyone about possible domain acquisitions. And to be crystal clear I don't engage in this practice nor have i implied I was looking to register TM names. It was simply a thought yesterday! Have a nice night

 

[grcorp]

appreciate the advice Draggar its probably unnecessary at this point as I will just mind my own business and not suggest advice to anyone about possible domain acquisitions. And to be crystal clear I don't engage in this practice nor have i implied I was looking to register TM names. It was simply a thought yesterday! Have a nice night

Don't get me wrong... you have the right idea in terms of looking out for them, but the second that you try to turn a profit, or even if you simply APPEAR to be trying to turn a profit, you will give off the wrong impression altogether.

It's hit or miss to be honest with you, if you have a "good faith" intention of getting the name so it won't fall into the wrong hands and passing it onto them at cost doesn't stand to make you a profit. But if you genuinely feel like doing them a favour, it can work out.

A perfect example of this is during the fall, I managed to secure a .ca domain name which was the exact name of a major apparel manufacturer (traded on the NYSE), and I offered to transfer it to them at my cost. I did this as...

a) I want to establish a track record of being a no-nonsense domainer who cares and has respect for reputations and goodwill, since oftentimes domainers are saddled with an automatic "cybersquatter" title

and

b) I really like the brand, and wanted to do them a favour

Wouldn't you know, their lead trademark counsel was a very, very nice guy who not only gave me zero hassle over it all, but ended up sending me a bunch of free apparel!

So, getting to the point of what you're saying, I would advise AGAINST doing it in bulk as

a) It is impossible for you to profit off of this if you intend on passing it on at your own cost
b) Even if you try to pass it on at your own cost, you can be accused of cybersquatting, regardless of your intentions, with said accusations running anywhere from a "f*** off!" to a cease and desist letter
c) If they haven't got a website or web presence by now, that ought to tell you something as to just how much of a hoot they give about the internet and their business

A partner and I were trying to push a "basic website" solution to local businesses in late 2009, and we ran up against brick walls over the place, as everybody who hasn't got a website yet is getting contacted by web developers.

That said, to them, you'll blend right in with the rest of the hotshot web developers.

Now, if you happen to know a key person in these businesses personally, it may be worth mentioning, but I'd only say it in passing, and let them register it on their own terms.

So, I think that your heart is in the right place, but in my honest opinion, this will stand to do you more harm than good.

 

[iestates]

When you are registering local business names, they better be generic like discussed in DNF college.

Stuff like BostonPlumber.com, SeattleLawyer.com, etc

Totally agree with this. We see returns in the range of 10-30x on these types of names.

 

[AtTheLake]

When you are registering local business names, they better be generic like discussed in DNF college.

Stuff like BostonPlumber.com, SeattleLawyer.com, etc

Totally agree with this. We see returns in the range of 10-30x on these types of names.

Iam 100% agreeable on this line of thinking; the only issue i will bring up and keep in mind this is after hours of searching and attempts. How many more BostonPlumbers.com do you guys think are available? cause I am finding virtually none of this type of generic available for any more major rnglish speaking city of any sort, from plumber to hvac to pool guy etc. They have mostly been registered up awhile ago.

 

[grcorp]

Iam 100% agreeable on this line of thinking; the only issue i will bring up and keep in mind this is after hours of searching and attempts. How many more BostonPlumbers.com do you guys think are available? cause I am finding virtually none of this type of generic available for any more major rnglish speaking city of any sort, from plumber to hvac to pool guy etc. They have mostly been registered up awhile ago.

I would say this is rather self-explanatory. I don't consider keyword combinations such as bostonplumbers to be of such magnitude that dropcatchers like snapnames or namejet would detect them once dropped. This can lead to them becoming available without any attention being paid to them.

What I'm trying to say is that all the good ones have BEEN registered, but that does not mean that they are STILL registered. And this is where performing a "dictionary attack", as it were, of keyword combinations can turn up excellent results.

 

[draggar]

Iam 100% agreeable on this line of thinking; the only issue i will bring up and keep in mind this is after hours of searching and attempts. How many more BostonPlumbers.com do you guys think are available? cause I am finding virtually none of this type of generic available for any more major rnglish speaking city of any sort, from plumber to hvac to pool guy etc. They have mostly been registered up awhile ago.

Please, keep that attitude. It'll leave more for me to register. :smilewinkgrin: I've picked up quite a few geo + keyword generics over the past year.

Edit: Oh yeah, and when the .com is available, also pick up the .net and .org, you can easily double your asking price for letting them corner the market in most of the type-ins.

 

[AtTheLake]

Hello draggar,

My post was not meant to carry a certain tone of attitude or general conclusion; just simply the thought at the moment. I am very much generally a realist and scientific approach based, as I do believe and evaluate nearly all possibilities by a reasonable standard, I certainly seem to miss a few here and there. So have at it! If registering the so called remaining domains are worth registering and sitting on, for whatever specific time period to make it worth one's time (Please Do!). I have came up with a more specific approach to end users in Geo category and seems to have a little bit of promise. Anyways I am at the lake and hey it's starting to unfreeze and can't wait to catch a few 6 lb der's here soon and focus on something other than reading, studying, domains, ip rights, work, retirement etc.