Fraud guys i need your help important

[TheLegendaryJP]

Ok here's my take on it....

You transfered the name to him.
He transfered it back to you AFTER first requesting transfer out to his enom from his account.
He could not immediately transfer as per their TOS so that is why he got pissy and sent it back, I assume, makes sense.
It did get back to your account BUT for some reason which btw is a HUGE flaw if for real it still ended up getting transfered out to enom and his earlier request was processed AND may have been a request WITH privacy thus why it went to private whois today IF it did still unclear imo.


Now after reviewing that I have a few questions...

1) How many days did you leave for inspection at escrow.com?
2) Have you had ANY contact with him since that return, anything, email, call ?

It could be he backed out, which he may have had a right to, remember inspection time, he did return the name as he should have if he was in the right to do so. The issue may have been a glitch with moniker which allowed the request to go through eventhough it was from a different account as the name was back with you, technical error.


BTW look at last whois, he is VERY easy to find and IS apparently an end user.

So take a deep breath and tell me you havent spoken yet to him and didnt fly off the handle and make him say screw you when its all really a tech error and he needs to hand the name over or close...

 

[ydnaemsti]

If the above post is what happened then there is no fraud and the buyer did the right thing. I would not even blame Escrow or Moniker. There is no technical error if you ask me.

I do this all the time. I buy a domain from a seller and he pushes it to my account at the same registrar. Then I transfer it out to my own registrar (different then current). All email approvals and whatever is required is approved by me and I wait for the domain.

The only difference in this case is the domain changed owner while at registrar 1. Since the transfer at Moniker it seems works at the domain level only (which actually does not matter) and does not look which account approved the transfer it went through. I'm not sure if it's a technical error, this is more of a preference at Moniker. Maybe Moniker should freeze the domain while a transfer is pending. That way it would be clear what is happening.

I'm not surprised as there is a bug with Moniker transfers. I started to transfer my domains from a registrar into Moniker. Later I went and started another transfer from a second registrar without approving the first transfer to Moniker. Moniker was sending me the "Transfer Fail" email for a month until I called support.

Here is why there is no technical error and why Moniker is not at fault:

1. The buyer could simply transfer the domain from your Moniker account to his eNom account, change whois into your name and tell Escrow he does not have the domain.
He would never need to make that extra push to your Moniker account you're talking about. So you see even if Moniker would block the transfer, because the approval account and current account at Moniker were different the buyer would be able to do what has happened here. The end result is he could pretend he does not own a domain no matter which route Moniker goes.

Both Escrow.com and Moniker.com are legally not liable for this, but Escrow.com should extend the inspection until this is investigated. Escrow.com is missing an account at every major registrar. It would make thier business better.

You should feel lucky, because there is another scenario one could pull off when using Escrow.com. It has a 100% success ratio, and very hard to roll back, but I will not suggest it here. This whole thing makes me rethink this transfer thing.

 

[TheLegendaryJP]

I am not saying moniker is respondsible, if anything it appears (hopefully) it is all just a error and the buyer is not commiting fraud, period. We can come up with 100 ways to abuse a service but just focusing on this case. While he can deny receiving the name it does NOT release their funds back either, tbh it is a silly way to steal a name because you the theif tied up funds in a dispute too! Lets not forget that, the senario has road blocks, trus me, I do millions with them and know what I need to do to get funds should my buyer pass out for a week in Vegas lol

I have used escrow.com for years and dozens of domains with not one problem, maybe I am fortunate.

 

[chillking]

I transferd the domain to his moniker account he had 3 days for the inspection period we all told him it takes 5 to 7 days to transfer the domain to enom.com after about a few days he tryed to cancell his credit card transaction with his credit card company he pushed the domain back to my account after about 7 days i did not even see the domain in my account it must of been their for mins or like a hour. Then i see it at enom.com with all the owners contact info on the whoi then i inform escrow.com then they tell him then he changes the whois to private. I expected him to change the whois to private i told escrow.com he would but the still told him. So some one was changing his contact information in his enom.com whois. I asked enom.com they told me he owns the domain name he claims the domain is not in his enom.com account and tells escrow.com he does not have the domain name and demands his money back. He 100% has the domain in his enom.com account according to moniker and when i seen the whois and enom.com told me he is the owner. Thanks JP what would you do now ?.

 

[TheLegendaryJP]

I transferd the domain to his moniker account he had 3 days for the inspection period we all told him it takes 5 to 7 days to transfer the domain to enom.com after about a few days he tryed to cancell his credit card transaction with his credit card company he pushed the domain back to my account after about 7 days i did not even see the domain in my account it must of been their for mins or like a hour. Then i see it at enom.com with all the owners contact info on the whoi then i inform escrow.com then they tell him then he changes the whois to private. I expected him to change the whois to private i told escrow.com he would but the still told him. So some one was changing his contact information in his enom.com whois. I asked enom.com they told me he owns the domain name he claims the domain is not in his enom.com account and tells escrow.com he does not have the domain name and demands his money back. He 100% has the domain in his enom.com account according to moniker and when i seen the whois and enom.com told me he is the owner. Thanks JP what would you do now ?.

I see, so he is denying he has the name and has tried to get funds released.

I am disappointed to hear Escrow has been so tough on this, we need to focus on you getting the name back or buyer to release funds, either way works I assume.

Email the buyer again and state escrow.com funds will be tied up for an indefinite amount of time now so cough up the name and you will cooperate to get his funds back OR release funds at escrow.

I would than call escrow.com on the phone ask politely to speak with a rep, point him to this thread and show evidence of the transfer etc. ( Again always been good to me so I am disheartened to hear they are being hard to convince ).

Lastly I am sending you a PM for one other way to confirm his ownership at enom.

 

[chillking]

Thanks a lot jp mate.


I have now said to escrow.com that moniker.com has confirmed the buyer transferd the domain to his enom.com account so can you release the funds but i do not think they will i'll let use know the response.

 

[dap]

Prove to them you do not have the domain...show them your account
in which is was transferred and the email you received (should have) that is was transfered and go after their ass.

Escrow.com is unsafe and has no controle over domain names.

Hi guy's i done a deal through escrow.com i sold a domain name for $x,xxx the domain name was ment to be transferd from my moniker account to the buyers moniker account. The buyer paid escrow.com escrow.com confirmed the has paid and for me to transfer the domain to the buyer. I transferd the domain to the buyers moniker account after like 4 days he said he did not want the domain because he needs it transfering to enom fast but he would not transfer it back then after like 7 days he told me he transferd it to my account and then the next thing i know is it was at enom.com register under his name then he changes his enom whois to private. And claims he does not have the domain in his account.

Escrow does not beleive me and they are holding the funds i need real help.

 

[axeman]

Is it possible, apart from what we already know, that the buyer did a charge back on their credit card, further complicating matters, i notice you mentioned this chillking. Hence if escrow have no money, the domain really needs to be returned as the only option. Is this the situation?

 

[theinvestor]

Escrow should not have let him transfer the name until they have written authorization regarding the transaction. It was my understanding they make you sign to the transaction when you use a credit card.

 

[chillking]

Hi guys i finally got the domain name back but they had to transfer it to my enom.com account and i noticed it had a private id protection on it and i said the private id expires in 15,12,2010 so that looks like when the guy got the domain on the 15th he must of bought 1 years id protection to attempted hide he was the owner the domain. I'm very happy thanks to your advice and thanks to moniker.com. My advice to every one use moniker.com escrow or sedo escrow but were you transfer to a sedo agent. Escrow.com have no control over your domain they only go by the sellers word and the buyers word so do not use them i have used them many times and things have been fine untill now thanks guys.

 

[David G]

...Escrow.com have no control over your domain they only go by the sellers word and the buyers word so do not use them i have used them many times and things have been fine untill now thanks guys.

Thar's what I have been saying for years. The main reason everyone uses them is because of their great domain name. The are alledgedly not secure with domains and rely heavily on buyer and sellers honesty. imo, you are better off with an escrow who actually takes control of the domain.

 

[Theo]

This transaction was the epitome of wrong-doing on behalf of the seller.

Never go into lengthy inspection periods. If the buyer wants more than 1 day to "approve" tell them, no deal.

Don't allow them to transfer the domain to another registrar as part of the deal.

Always CC Escrow.com on the communication with the buyer, including the login/pass credentials.

Ideally, always push the domain to an account that you have created for the buyer. If you are also a reseller, create that account under your main account as an extra safety control.

 

[chillking]

Acro because you do not know the full details i do not think you know what happend i transferd the domain to his moniker account from my moniker account , then he did not confirm he had the domain then he cancelled his credit card. And started a transfer to enom.com then he told escrow.com he might still have the domain he had the domain for like 7 days that was out of my power and out of escrows power. Then when it landed at enom he put it in private whois and said he does not have the domain and said he transferd it back to my moniker account.

Thar's what I have been saying for years. The main reason everyone uses them is because of their great domain name. The are alledgedly not secure with domains and rely heavily on buyer and sellers honesty. imo, you are better off with an escrow who actually takes control of the domain.

Thanks trader i agree.

 

[Mike Cruz]

This transaction was the epitome of wrong-doing on behalf of the seller.

Never go into lengthy inspection periods. If the buyer wants more than 1 day to "approve" tell them, no deal.

Don't allow them to transfer the domain to another registrar as part of the deal.

Always CC Escrow.com on the communication with the buyer, including the login/pass credentials.

Ideally, always push the domain to an account that you have created for the buyer. If you are also a reseller, create that account under your main account as an extra safety control.

Just out of curiousity, why go through that trouble if Moniker Escrow or Sedo escrow will eliminate all that hassle and the specialize in the exact service we need both as buyers and sellers?

 

[Theo]

Here it is again in bold: Inspection period should not be longer than 1 day.

What this does is, that even if the buyer stalls and fails to respond, Escrow.com WILL proceed with the "transaction is complete" step.

Acro because you do not know the full details i do not think you know what happend i transferd the domain to his moniker account from my moniker account , then he did not confirm he had the domain then he cancelled his credit card. And started a transfer to enom.com then he told escrow.com he might still have the domain he had the domain for like 7 days that was out of my power and out of escrows power. Then when it landed at enom he put it in private whois and said he does not have the domain and said he transferd it back to my moniker account.




Thanks trader i agree.

Just out of curiousity, why go through that trouble if Moniker Escrow or Sedo escrow will eliminate all that hassle and the specialize in the exact service we need both as buyers and sellers?

Not all end users are domainers or are familiar with anything outside of the Escrow.com process; simply because being asked to place bids via an online platform geared towards domainers doesn't always sit well with some buyers.

Each domain selling platform has its pluses and minuses and even different fees. Sedo charges 10% while Escrow.com considerably less.

It's good to have options, however to blame Escrow.com for this failure here is not smart.

 

[chillking]

Acro what your saying is even if the buyer says he does not have the domain escrow.com will still release the funds ? after 1 day i never herd of that.

As Zurc just said i totally agree why do it when it can be smoother.

Just out of curiousity, why go through that trouble if Moniker Escrow or Sedo escrow will eliminate all that hassle and the specialize in the exact service we need both as buyers and sellers?

 

[Theo]

When you push the domain to the buyer, copy Escrow.com on that email demonstrating that you've done your part. That's when the inspection period begins. And stay on top of it. Once the inspection period ends - 1 day - contact Escrow.com again to remind them it's all done. I've had dozens of Escrow.com transactions with no issues whatsoever.

 

[chillking]

Well i'm blaming my self for putting my trust in Escrow.com because their system is not smart but crap.

 

[Theo]

When the finger points at someone, four fingers point back

I explained why you didn't take care of it yourself, so how do you expect others to take care of it for you?

Be glad you got the domain back.

 

[chillking]

Acro as i said im very happy i got the domain back but next time im using moniker escrow or sedo transfer agents.