Google - The WWW subdomain dilemma

Nexus · May 8, 2003

Ok, working with FreeWho's new link popularity checker, I uncovered a little problem. A colleague of mine, while using the website was bothered by the fact that it reported that Google had NO results for him. I checked, and sure enough, NO RESULTS. He then proceeded to show me how he could get results from Google by adding "www" to his links: request.

It wasn't a problem for me to update the script to correct for this (I've gone ahead and done it), but it presented an interesting difference Google displays that sets it apart in an odd fashion from other search engines.

My current assumption is that it has something to do with NAME-BASED websites, versus IP-BASED sites.

Look at these results:
DOMAINSTATE.COM
http://www.freewho.com/linkpop?q=domainstate.com
DNFORUM.COM
http://www.freewho.com/linkpop?q=dnforum.com
FIGMA.COM
http://www.freewho.com/linkpop?q=figma.com
ADIESEL.COM
http://www.freewho.com/linkpop?q=adiesel.com

My NEW logic goes: whenever the results equal each other, that result is used; whenever they differ, they are added together. From DomainState.com's results, I was able to make a basic assumption that the two results from the returns are mutually exclusive.

Anyone else have insights to share, it'd be appreciated.

Best Regards,
~ Nexus

Nexus · May 8, 2003

What I was getting at above is that most all the other search engines, aside from GOOGLE (in certain circumstances), seem to view "www.SLD.TLD" as synonymous with "SLD.TLD". Google doesn't always do that... and Google is clearly the reigning king.

It only came out in the link popularity results (if you look at MarketLeap.com, they only pull off of the exact SLD.TLD you type in as well for Google). Widexl's linkpop tool does not distinuguish this either ( view here ), so people may end up with Google results that don't seem to make sense. It is a concern, because while link popularity results only note that more folks may point to one or the other, it may have wider baring, as your PageRank may be partially related to how many of your visitors and traffic come in under a subdomain vs. NO subdomain.

Here's an example. Right now, I'm looking at the DNFORUM.COM PageRank. It has a PageRank of 6/10 (like DS). Now, if I go to WWW.DNFORUM.COM and use my Google toolbar to see the PageRank here, suddenly it appears to be 7/10. But its the SAME PAGE! Its not a drastic difference, but the link popularity results present a big gap: DNFORUM.COM alone has 20 links, while WWW.DNFORUM.COM has 844 links on Google ( view here ). Dnforum is on a name-based set-up, as evident by browsing to the IP address for the domain, and arriving at a secondary website just for the auction system. The server requires the name to resolve to the proper location. On the issue of PageRank, while the mainpage ranks 7/10 under WWW, secondary pages rank 6/10... though only 5/10 with no WWW in it.

Likewise, one of our partners is a company called Freeportway Software. Google's PageRank lists FREEPORTWAY.COM as "not ranked" and WWW.FREEPORTWAY.COM as 3/10. Now, I know that they're being penalized for that redirect on entering their website ( we didn't do that ), but other than that, linkpop says the WWW gets 20 links, while the non-www gets the goose egg.

Though the DOMAINSTATE.COM PageRank (6/10) does not appear to be affected by the difference in the linkpop for WWW vs. non-WWW ( view here ), I'm sure it may eventually manifest itself when the disparity is much greater than 4 to 40.

In trying to gain traffic and influence on the net, it sounds like this is a big deal to me. Little details like this can get overlooked, and entire levels of "importance" can be lost when appearing in search engine results.

Positioning other sites they have in search results is important to them, and some factor is diluting that at the subdomain level on Google. I'm thinking Google is (unintentionally?) "penalizing" name-based websites in this manner (as opposed to IP-based sites carrying a unique IP address). I don't think this is good.

This maybe common knowledge around SEO circles, but it was a recent discovery for me that makes me rethink a few practices.

~ Nexus

bidawinner · May 8, 2003

Nexus, I have never noticed this before.. it is interesting. Google is at the tail end of an update .(maybe is an anomaly druning update)

I wonder if in 3-4 days these results arent inclusive of each other ? Probably not, but worth looking at agin in a few days.

Have you tried asking at webmasterworld.com under google.com they should know for sure

Nexus · May 8, 2003

Haven't tried that yet, thanks bid. I'll check in this weekend. Always been meaning to make them part of my rounds.

~ Nexus

Nexus · May 8, 2003

Y'know... I'll still ask, but I've decided that its just something for webmasters to be aware of. Google view WWW and "no-subdomain" as two separate entities if on a namebased server. I guess that's all there is to it. Get an IP, or suffer a split personality. Goes to what you noted, and I'd heard. I wasn't clear about the nature of the "problems", but I assume there more to that as well.

~ Nexus