Scammer accountss, moderators, banned accounts, and CYOA

[draggar]

Hey all,

We've seen an influx of scammers coming onto the board recently and luckily most of us are too savvy to fall for the games.

I've seen several threads like this and the first thing people complain about is the fact that the accounts are not instantly banned. While I do agree that they should be banned, the leadership of this forum (or any forum especially where paid memberships are concerned) need to cover their @$$es. They cannot just ban someone on suspicion or without a good cause or else this board could end up in a lawsuit.

The moderators / administrators need to be able to verify the information and hear the alleged scammer's side before they take action. Who knows, maybe the person yesterday did have a legitimate claim to 007.com (as highly unlikely as it is).

I think the moderators and administrators have done a good job at investigating these issues and acted appropriately. I also think they've done a good job at communicating with us here letting us know what is going on and how far along any investigations are.

The last thing I'd want to see here is for a scammer to file a lawsuit against the board and them win the board (then we'd all be f-ed) for their own scammer ways. Yeah, it's a crappy thing to think about, but it's a real threat the leadership of this board needs to look at while performing any kind of corrective action.

Yeah, most scammers wouldn't win a case (especially with the amount of proof that this board can supply) but it would be wasted time (and money) for the owners of the forum and there are some scammers out there who are savvy enough to be able to work the system(s) in their favor to win a case like this.


Give them time, they will act and get rid of the scammer scum in time when they show their heads here in the safest way (for the forum) possible.

 

[Theo]

A scammer filing a lawsuit? Now that's an oxymoron.

An obvious scam, like someone apparently selling a LLL .com for $600 should lead to instant de-activation of the offending account.

 

[draggar]

A scammer filing a lawsuit? Now that's an oxymoron.

It's happened and I've seen it with the company I work for. People stealing and committing fraud yet sued (the company) because they were fired.

An obvious scam, like someone apparently selling a LLL .com for $600 should lead to instant de-activation of the offending account.

So, selling an LLL.com for $600 is an automatic scam? Don't forget, someone tried to buy Cowboys.com for $270 last year so there are some people out there in the domaining world who do not know what they have or what things are worth.

(Yes, I know it was a lawyer who tried to buy Cowboys.com, but it shows that people do pop in this industry not knowing much about values).

Sure, an LLL.com is worth a lot to us, but what if someone inherited it because the owner did and didn't realize what they had? If they're down in their luck and need the cash, they might offload it for $600 not realizing they could get a hundred to a thousand times that.

 

[Devil Dog]

Brownnoser.

j/k​

 

[Theo]

So, selling an LLL.com for $600 is an automatic scam?

Yes it is. Period.

Sure, an LLL.com is worth a lot to us, but what if someone inherited it because the owner did and didn't realize what they had? If they're down in their luck and need the cash, they might offload it for $600 not realizing they could get a hundred to a thousand times that.

They'd need to invent time travel and go back to 2002 for this price to be valid.

 

[9MM]

Someone may be generous some day and sell a LLL.com for $600, likely if they are a billionaire, but the truth is, legally, I don't think we can just jump to conclusions. If someone like idevlabs / b.king or even acroplex offers a LLL.com for $600 which they own, can you really just ban that member? No...so why change the rules on a member who just joined? While I agree, it is pretty much 99.999% scam, there are always other ways to go about it. For instance, the latest issue was dnm.com, posted by crazyseller. Lord Brar took actions which I felt were appropiate by adding a large note on the original post to say not to deal with this person yet as we are awaiting confirmation of ownership. By doing this, anyone who reads the post should know enough to wait, and that is for their own safety.

In this case, the guy thought being an exclusive member makes himself more trusted and that the scam would work, and solve with him receiving the money in his e-gold account, however not too many people are that dense. Maybe there should be certain requirements for selling names above a certain price or something, maybe new exclusive members should get verified in some way, however if all the scammers are like the guy we just saw, I don't think there is too much to worry about.

I'm not arguing your point acro, anyone selling an LLL.com for $600 is either a scammer, or a complete nut case/generous rich person.

 

[Theo]

You want to perpetuate stupid reasons of how an obviously non-legit sale is potentially valid, be my guest.

We are not here to take second guesses when it's obvious that a sale is not legit.

The key to maintaining an active, professional forum is to freeze all illegal activities in their track.

In fact, I would freeze all Exclusive memberships right now and offer them on an approval basis.

 

[9MM]

You want to perpetuate stupid reasons of how an obviously non-legit sale is potentially valid, be my guest.

We are not here to take second guesses when it's obvious that a sale is not legit.

The key to maintaining an active, professional forum is to freeze all illegal activities in their track.

In fact, I would freeze all Exclusive memberships right now and offer them on an approval basis.

I somewhat agree about the exclusive memberships. Especially if a member signs up and becomes exclusive right away, most people would be gold then plat, or even just plat, before they become exclusive. Maybe new exclusive members should have to verify themselves and be approved.

I'm not arguing that a sale like that is obvious as a scam, but there are certain situations which are the odds of winning the lottery, but do occur, and I am sure that the admin/staff would definitely prefer the right actions legally to be taken before the member is banned. However, in the previous case of 007.com and even dnm.com, I do agree in a fast account termination.

Not here to argue with you acro, we are both on the same team :smilewinkgrin:

 

[draggar]

I somewhat agree about the exclusive memberships. Especially if a member signs up and becomes exclusive right away, most people would be gold then plat, or even just plat, before they become exclusive. Maybe new exclusive members should have to verify themselves and be approved.

I guess I'm not normal, I spent a few days at gold then went exclusive. :undecided:

Verification would be a good idea, I would do that in a heartbeat (in fact, I've seen verified seals on some members, do they still offer that?)

Most people here could recognize a scam in a second, there is no doubt of that but the truth is that legally, especially when paid subscriptions are involved, the leadership cannot have any knee-jerk reactions or else they could end up being sued. it is the sad truth in today's world where thieves, scam artists, and con artists are looked at as victims.

 

[9MM]

Verified seals is still available, which would be a good idea because if a scammer comes and has to prove his residence, I'm sure he won't want to be exclusive any more.

Well I'm not surprised if people jump to exclusive, if I had Paypal, I'd be there already, but got to wait to work a trade out or something

 

[Dale Hubbard]

Some simple facts as I see them:

1. Just because someone is 'exclusive' doesn't mean they inherit automatic trustability.

2. The forum management have the right to ban anyone they care without reason.

3. 'Exclusive' membership is a commercial entity -- not a trust yardstick. You can generally work out someone's reputation by a) Trader feedback; b) Longevity here, c) What they say from time to time, d) Post count (not infallible, but combined with the other three, a pretty good measure).

 

[Bill Roy]

Well I signed up as Exclusive straight away, what is wrong with that?

As for 'approval' this raises several dilemas.

1) Who would 'approve' the applications?
2) What would be the criteria for 'approval'? (Only after this length of time? Only if you have purchased a set monetry amount of domains? Only if you own a LL.com or NN.com? Only if you have posted a set number of posts a day? Only if all other Exclusives accept you by ballot? Only if you your politics are acceptable to the 'approval' board? Etc., etc..)
3) Would all existing Exclusives have to be vetted so as they comply with the requirements of the new 'approval' dogma?
4) Could a person lose their Exclusive membership if they were found to be not upholding the 'approval' criteria?

These are just some of the problems that spring readily to mind.

 

[draggar]

As for 'approval' this raises several dilemas.

1) Who would 'approve' the applications?
2) What would be the criteria for 'approval'? (Only after this length of time? Only if you have purchased a set monetry amount of domains? Only if you own a LL.com or NN.com? Only if you have posted a set number of posts a day? Only if all other Exclusives accept you by ballot? Only if you your politics are acceptable to the 'approval' board? Etc., etc..)
3) Would all existing Exclusives have to be vetted so as they comply with the requirements of the new 'approval' dogma?
4) Could a person lose their Exclusive membership if they were found to be not upholding the 'approval' criteria?

These are just some of the problems that spring readily to mind.

Click on the seal next to Azooza's avatar - this verification could be a requirement for exclusive membership.

 

[stewie]

how do we verify or get that seal??? that is a great idea

means more than gold, plat or exclusive...its a proof of ID... that is good.

(heres to hoping its free to get as well)

 

[Bill Roy]

The problem is this will not stop scammers!

The requirement is $5 via 2checkout or verified Paypal (just think how many scams are carried out by those using a verified Paypal account), and a copy of a recent utility bill (now let me think, how many people would not be able to scan a document into their computer and change the details).

Nothing wrong with being a verified member but even as it says you should not associate a verified member sign with reliability or business ethics of the person holding it.

 

[Dale Hubbard]

The problem is this will not stop scammers!

The requirement is $5 via 2checkout or verified Paypal (just think how many scams are carried out by those using a verified Paypal account), and a copy of a recent utility bill (now let me think, how many people would not be able to scan a document into their computer and change the details).

Nothing wrong with being a verified member but even as it says you should not associate a verified member sign with reliability or business ethics of the person holding it.

True.

 

[draggar]

Then can I go buy MediaHound a beer (or whatever his poison is?), he lives a few towns over from me, I'll even take him out to the rodeo next time they actually have something rodeo-related.

Click on the seal to see how you can become "verified".

 

[Andrew Shaw]

From what I understand: Accounts are subject to termination at any given time without any warning. I think the only thing to be done when someone is suspect of a scam, is to have there account disabled WHILE an investigation is being done. Haveing your account disabled does not justify a lawsuit, as everyone that joined this forum has agreed to DNF's terms of services.

Admin... If a member is banned, is there usually someone who checks up on the IP to make sure there were not multiple registrations? If another account is found, are the IP locations then examined to find other potential registrations?

The easiest way I use to find when scammers had multiple user names was doing a search user name for IP. If multiple IP's come up, I then added each IP to the Search Ip for members... It can lead to a chain of memberships.

 

[MediaHound]

I've added a link to the header that takes you to the "Get Verified" page,
http://www.dnforum.com/dnfverified.php
This link may also be found at the bottom of the membership plans page:
http://www.dnforum.com/plans.php
As suggested, you may click anybody's seal to also be taken to the page.

We also have a page setup to offer information regarding "Best Practices" of being a domain name buyer and seller:
http://www.dnforum.com/bestpractices.php

There's a discussion thread about the best practices page here: http://www.dnforum.com/f77/best-practices-being-domain-name-buyer-seller-thread-275882.html
Please add your thoughts to it so we can add them to the page.

There's some good points that are brought up and we appreciate the discussion.

 

[MediaHound]

Andrew, yes we are aware of the IP methodology to reveal things. We have measures in place and an escalation procedure as well.