Almost impossible to grab 'good' expiring names - unfair system favoring BuyDomains

[David G]

There is always a lot of talk about how BuyDomains.com manages to grab as much as 90% of all the 'good' dropped names. Perhaps someone needs to file a class action suit against ICANN over this as it is grossly unfair that buydomains and its owner Michael Mann alledgedly dominates the drops like they do, with some occasional small success by the Koreans, Chinese and SnapNames.

It's said BuyDomains.com owns approx' 100,000 names for their own resale acct. I have dealt with them for some time and know about its Pres/Owner Michael Mann and their amazing success at reg'ing and selling zillions of domains for their own acct.

They have by far the best large portfolio of names. Mostly popular 2 or 3 word phrase or product type of names, for example names such as TradingSystems.com, one of their numerous recent buys.

Very often when I do a Whois on a name I am interested in or try to get a SnapBack on it via SnapNames the owner or expired buyer is BuyDomains. It happens all the time.

Since they are in partnership with Domain Discover, a large accredited Registrar & Wholesaler, they are alleged to have access to the expired list perhaps the day before others do. Several times I tried to grab names from expired lists within minutes of getting it but the name was somehow seemingly taken 24-hrs earlier by BuyDomains.

It's alleged they monitor the zillions of names reg'd for their own clients and possibly grab them for themselves before they are allowed to actually drop, or approx' the same time as the drop time and date, but before they hit the public expired services list. Any insider track seems very unfair and should be stopped but who could stop it I don't think ICANN really cares.

If this continues much longer BuyDomains.com may end up owning the vast majority of the 'good names' and dominate the resale market. They already appear to be doing that and seem to be by far the #1 reseller. The quality of their names is also top-notch. They only reg 'good' expired names.

They monitor their names very closely and its also all computerized by an expert programmer. Type in one of their names in your Browser and it goes to their for sale page, etc. They also do heavy followup emailing to you if you inquire about a domain they own.

It would seem extremely unlikely any of their good names would ever drop from their list so I don't understand all this discussion in past threads about access to their domains owned list. BuyDomains is clearly the #1 player in the market.

Their apparent alleged access to the drops 24-hrs or more before they hit expired lists, plus their own registration records access as a large Affiliate of an ICANN Registrar alledgedly gives then a huge unfair advantage, seemingly making it almost worthless for the average player to bother looking for good drops.

This is why once my several remaining SnapNames conclude, I won't even bother to try to reg drops anymore, too much of an unlevel playing field tilted in favor of BuyDomains. Also, Chinese & Koreans with powerful scripts running 24 hrs a day get the rest it seems. I know this from much bitter personal experience!

 

[AMERICAR]

Hmm.

I know that you guys know that this is a public forum, everything that is said goes on record ' FOREVER ' even if the thread was deleted.

Im just saying be carefull what you say, thats all.

by the way i know nuffin.

 

[ad-lib]

Yesterday called, and so did beatz....
they want there topic back!

 

[David G]

Originally posted by AMERICAR
Hmm. I know that you guys know that this is a public forum, everything that is said goes on record ' FOREVER ' even if the thread was deleted. Im just saying be carefull what you say, thats all. by the way i know nuffin.

What are you afraid could happen? Do you deny what was said by several different members here about how buydomains unjustly alledgedly dominates the expired market?

By the way, are you sure this is a public forum. How could it be public if one needs to become a member and register?

 

[beatz]

RealNames ...i couldn't agree more.You just took the words out of my mouth.
That's why i said it should be illegal somehow what Buydomains does: Because of their unfair competition that bases on a registrar using his rrp literally ONLY for Buydomains.com a lot of public snapback-companies might go broke.Simply because nobody sees any sense in having an account even at snapnames anymore when it's BD that get the good drops anyway.

 

Originally posted by RealNames


What are you afraid could happen? Do you deny what was said by several different members here about how buydomains unjustly alledgedly dominates the expired market?

By the way, are you sure this is a public forum. How could it be public if one needs to become a member and register?

This is why I believe that the fairest way to distribute dropped domain names (for which there is a demand) is to have public auctions run by ICANN...sort of like government auctions for seized property. This way everyone has a fair chance to bid on domains, and the profits go to the non-profit org charged with the task of maintaining the DNS.

Miles

P.S. Domains with no demand--shown after an appropriate opportunity is given to the public to show interest and place a bid on a domain--would simply be returned to the available pool of unregged domains.

 

Realnames, your post is the kind of conjecture people were coming out with back when the drops first started and before people understood how it operated. Comments like:

they are alleged to have access to the expired list perhaps the day before others do

are totallly inaccurate as anyone who understands the mechanics of the deletion process can confirm. There is nothing stopping you making your own drop list from publicly available information (hint: diff the zone files).

If people spent less time complaining about buydomains and more time improving their own drop getting skills (you don't get everything handed to you on a plate in this ultra competitive industry) - they might actually get somewhere.

 

[AMERICAR]

Really RealNames,

It does not get any more public than the internet, nobody has to become a member and log on to read this.

I still no-nuffin.

 

[David G]

Safesys said "...Realnames, your post is the kind of conjecture people were coming out with back when the drops first started and before people understood how it operated. Comments like: quote: they are alleged to have access to the expired list perhaps the day before others do... are totallly inaccurate..."

If you are correct and they do not have early access to drops then why is it so that I tried to reg a number of names within minutes of getting drop lists and found the names taken by buydomains approx' 24 hrs earlier??

 

Originally posted by RealNames


If you are correct and they do not have early access to drops then why is it so that I tried to reg a number of names within minutes of getting drop lists and found the names taken by buydomains approx' 24 hrs earlier??

perhaps they dropped 24 hrs earlier?

 

[David G]

Originally posted by snoopy
perhaps they dropped 24 hrs earlier?

If so, why do I always get the drop lists 24-hrs late from different expired services. What good are they if they are that late? How does one get the drop list immidiately?

I still maintain you guys who seem to be defending BuyDomains are wrong and what I said in my first post is much more likely to be the correct scenario.

 

well I don't see what they are doing wrong, being the fastest and best is not a crime.

 

Isn't that a failing of the drop list services then?

Like snoop says, its no crime to be better prepared.

It takes research, time and money to be the best. If you're not putting large quantities of all 3 into your drop getting, then what do you expect?

 

[David G]

Originally posted by snoopy
well I don't see what they are doing wrong, being the fastest and best is not a crime.

I fail to understand why you and safesys think buydomains does NOT have an unfair advantage?

It is very obvious they do, after all, they are a large affiliate of an ICANN Registrar and also have zillions of their own names as a large and excellent Registry Service. Many names reg'd there expire every day, which they can easily grab at the same moment they drop.

It has nothing to do with being 'good' or fast as you guys claim, it is alledgedly because of their insider status and an obvious unfair advantage.

Why is it so many others here are silent on this issue? I for one am stopping pursuit of expired names as between BuyDomains, Chinese and Koreans it's almost impossible to get 'good' ones.

 

I don't consider someone being better than me at something to be unfair.

If you want to be a serious player you have to act like a serious player and invest the time, effort and money it requires. Nothing unfair in that at all.

You talk about their registrar links, but the best names come from network solutions anyway - and even the ones from Domain Discover will have to go through the registry deletion process (unless they are transferred rather than dropped).

Neither you, nor me nor buydomains has any "rights" to be able to get good expiring domains. If you get one, its a bonus.

If you don't put in the same work as a competitor - you will lose.

 

[DnPowerful]

the real problem in all of this debate is a defanged ICANN.

I know some of you understand this, but most don't: The real problem is that the system needs a strong cop, and ICANN has always been secondary to lining NSI's pocket. The fact that ICANN has so little power and money means that "the players" in the game feel it's anarchy and must throw all their resources into maintaining an advantage, whether fair or not. And drawing the line between fair and not in this is completely a function of your perspective.

The problem has gone from "a problem" to a "disaster". Blaming the winners of the current system is silly. Blame the fact that domain owners allowed NSI/Verisign to pocket $6 on every registration for the incredibly difficult task of "maintaining the registry" (PLEASE!!) while ICANN starved.

The effects are now showing, but we're blaming the wrong people.

 

[David G]

If the fact BuyDomains seems to grab names so well based on skill and being good at it as you say, then why is it no one else who are also very smart and has money and lots of effort, seems to be nearly as successful as BuyDomains.com?

It is hard to believe Michael Mann is so much smarter and better than anyone else. Surely there must be a lot more to it than he being a genius and every one else who routinely gets beaten by him being slow or stupid or poorly funded.

Why is it you buydomains defenders never answered the questions on why the various expired list services seem to be consistently 24-hrs late when it comes to buydomains grabbing the good ones 24 hrs earlier? I have seen this happen zillions of times.

If Safesys and Snoopy are so well educated on all of this to be such allies of buydomains dominating this business then why is it you 2 guys can't help us all out by offering us the reasons BuyDomains beats us out so often, and telling us how we may compete?

 

[DnPowerful]

Realnames...

I think what safesys and myself are saying is: It may be a supreme advantage which is either fair or unfair. But to immediately assume it's unfair might be wrong.

I think that fairness is important, but on a personal level, probably not worth the effort to chase expired names.

 

I honestly thought we'd left the notion that competitve advantage in the domain drop game must be due to "illegality" and underhand dealing back in the last century.

To the casual internet user, the fact that a domain can be registered before the WHOIS has even shown it is available would seem to be suggestive of secret deals - but we all know better than that here.

To berate a company that makes the best from whats available to them seems at odds with what domain speculation is all about.

It saddens me and depresses me that people are bitter towards those that do well - rather than attempting to emulate their successes and putting in the effort needed to compete on a level playing field.

 

You just need to strike a deal with one of the many registrars out there for them to run your list of domains exclusively via their rrp connection at drop time. Thats all it would take to compete.

The problem with snap/ng/nw is that as they become more successful they have to go for more names and they become more dilute in their efforts and their results reflect that.

Why is it you buydomains defenders never answered the questions on why the various expired list services seem to be consistently 24-hrs late when it comes to buydomains grabbing the good ones 24 hrs earlier? I have seen this happen zillions of times.

You can make your own lists by diffing the zone files - and it would give you at least 5/6 days notice on a domain drop.