bakhtaran is a Scammer on DNForum - Stole Five 3-character.coms and $2550 from me

[Johnn]

Here's something I don't get: If this guy is hacking into paypal accounts to buy goods, Verifired accounts no less, how the F*** does paypal lay that responsibility on the seller? Seems to me like there is a lawsuit waiting to happen unless I'm missing something.

Paypal is not regulated by anyone in the banking industry (FDIC) but they can do everything a bank can and more....

 

[Raider]

Paypal didn't protect the seller in this case, but a lawsuit against a big company eBay/Paypal will be tough. I do agree that Paypal should be protecting the sellers as well.

I think your only fooling yourself Kwok, if you think Paypal is to blame for what happened to you. Paypal has many safeguards in place to prevent hacking and Phish attacks, could they be more secure? maybe, were they negligent? I doubt it, this is a separate issue for the court to decide, just because the account was hacked into, doesn't mean Paypal should let you have the money, that's just nonsense, I'm NOT a fan of Paypal, but if you understand how the chargeback system works, Paypal did exactly what they were supposed to do, your gripe should not be with Paypal, if your going to point fingers, point them in the direction of Visa/Mastercard or whatever card was used, there the ones in control here.

And BTW, Paypal does protect sellers, they provided you with $5000 in seller protection coverage, but you completely ignored Paypals warnings of selling intangible (digital) items, disqualifying you for the protection. Losing your domains to a crook is tough to take, but aside from Bakhtaran, I think you share the majority of responsibility.

 

[kwok]

I think your only fooling yourself Kwok, if you think Paypal is to blame for what happened to you. Paypal has many safeguards in place to prevent hacking and Phish attacks, could they be more secure? maybe, were they negligent? I doubt it, this is a separate issue for the court to decide, just because the account was hacked into, doesn't mean Paypal should let you have the money, that's just nonsense, I'm NOT a fan of Paypal, but if you understand how the chargeback system works, Paypal did exactly what they were supposed to do, your gripe should not be with Paypal, if your going to point fingers, point them in the direction of Visa/Mastercard or whatever card was used, there the ones in control here.

And BTW, Paypal does protect sellers, they provided you with $5000 in seller protection coverage, but you completely ignored Paypals warnings of selling intangible (digital) items, disqualifying you for the protection. Losing your domains to a crook is tough to take, but aside from Bakhtaran, I think you share the majority of responsibility.

I share majority of responsibility?? What can I do in this case to protect myself from being scammed?? People received emails from scammers trying to phish for their Paypal ID and password through fraudulent websites that they set up, and Paypal is not doing anything to improve their site to protect their users. Look at Bankofamerica.com, at least they are using a graphical picture to ensure the users that the website is the REAL site. What did Paypal do? Nothing, even countless people email them about the countinued problems at [email protected]. It is their responsibility to return the money to the rightful owner, but more importantly, they should be protecting the sellers as well.

 

[maroulis]

Kwok don't take it personally... as a rule of thumb I only accept paypal payments from PayPal verified members.. I ensure they've been around for long, I also ask them to send payment and include their physicall address to ship to as this is the ONLY way paypal shows if a user is indeed verified...

besides that use common sense, if offer too good to be true then it probably is....

 

[kwok]

Kwok don't take it personally... as a rule of thumb I only accept paypal payments from PayPal verified members.. I ensure they've been around for long, I also ask them to send payment and include their physicall address to ship to as this is the ONLY way paypal shows if a user is indeed verified...

besides that use common sense, if offer too good to be true then it probably is....

Maroulis, thanks for your advise. However, the scammer used a stolen Paypal account which is verified and includes a physical address. Nothing really the seller can do in this case.

 

[maroulis]

Maroulis, thanks for your advise. However, the scammer used a stolen Paypal account which is verified and includes a physical address. Nothing really the seller can do in this case.

agree this is the exception, but you should have checked his DNF feedback and/or chatted to him on the phone... proposing a real conversation most of the time deters the scammers...

 

[jberryhill]

Look at Bankofamerica.com

It is a point well taken. BOA's online anti-fraud measures, for those not familiar with them, are exactly the sort of thing that other financial providers should be doing. Basically, BOA provides a "countersign" that the user must confirm, and BOA does not take the user id and password on the same screen. It works like this:

Screen 1 - enter User ID

Screen 2 - BOA displays a picture and a phrase which the user selected when they set up their account. The password is entered on this screen.

The basic phishing scheme can't duplicate this behavior (there are other ways involving spyware, physical compromise of the user's computer or connection, which is why I say "basic")

The "Verified by Visa" program is a somewhat less good approach to the problem, but a step in the right direction.

I share majority of responsibility?

No. It is never appropriate to blame the victim. The point is that, yes there are scammers and, yes there are ways to avoid being scammed. Not having taken precautions is not an excuse for being scammed, but I'm sure that everyone hopes you do not do business this way in the future - because there is very little cost-effective recourse in these situations.

 

[Theo]

Another reason why US sanctions against certain countries should be lifted, so that international law would apply. Good luck prosecuting someone who's safely residing in Iran or Cuba for example.

 

[Raider]

I share majority of responsibility?? What can I do in this case to protect myself from being scammed??

Yes, I would say the lions share. If you took the time to read Paypals warnings that refer to digital (intangible) goods, you may not of sent this slimeball your domain names. Remember, your the seller and YOU choose the payment method and where you want it processed. In this instance, you chose Paypal rather than Cashiers check, Paypal rather than Escrow, I have to ask WHY? You must of know that credit card transactions can be reversed.

 

[Theo]

I've used Paypal for more than 6 years for tangible and intangible goods - the latter being domains and services. Never had a problem. It takes a scammer to create a problem, not a process. So you're professing to the wrong crew here. The only thing is, I do not deal with ppl with zero or very recent feedback.

 

[Johnn]

I think I am sicked and tired of these nonsense posts from this young lady trying to be smarta$$ - Get to the point and the question - Don't kicking around.

One thing you can do in this case is to ask the seller send you an email from the Paypal account email - There is less channce that the buyer can hack both the Paypal account and the email.

 

[Honan]

Kwok
Did you give the police report to enom?
Did you use the the email address for the enom that Adam provided?

 

[DNWizardX9]

I think I am sicked and tired of these nonsense posts from this young lady trying to be smarta$$ - Get to the point and the question - Don't kicking around.

One thing you can do in this case is to ask the seller send you an email from the Paypal account email - There is less channce that the buyer can hack both the Paypal account and the email.

Don't talk her down like that just because she's a woman. Her points are true. If you sell on paypal you are screwed if you sell intangible goods as they lack protection.

 

[Theo]

Don't talk her down like that just because she's a woman. Her points are true. If you sell on paypal you are screwed if you sell intangible goods as they lack protection.

Misinformation.

Not if you use eBay to sell those "intangible" goods. You are covered.

 

[Johnn]

I am not trying to talk her down because she is a woman - In every post she tried to be the expert in the field and did not answer the question.

I will say the same thing to a man or even someone is in between!

The thread is about how to help him with the case - Not to explain the process.

 

[maroulis]

I will say the same thing to a man or even someone is in between!

Would that cover gay, TS, ... population? LOL

 

[Raider]

Misinformation.

Not if you use eBay to sell those "intangible" goods. You are covered.

If you use Ebay and pay with Paypal, what protection are you referring to?

And thanks DNWizardX9 for trying to set Johnn straight, unfortuntely its a lost cause.

 

[Theo]

If you use Ebay and pay with Paypal, what protection are you referring to?

And thanks DNWizardX9 for trying to set Johnn straight, unfortuntely its a lost cause.

The protection that eBay offers, through its very owned company - Paypal.

 

[Domagon]

Misinformation.

Not if you use eBay to sell those "intangible" goods. You are covered.

Woah, that's news to me!? ... please post the link to this policy you speak of - from everything I've ever read, intangible goods are NOT covered...

Even if such goods are, the protection likely still wouldn't apply if one or more of the parties is located outside of certain select countries.

In addition, from what I've read, if one pays with PayPal on an Ebay listed item, then PayPal's payment policies apply NOT Ebay's.

On a related topic, one's feedback / registration date, email address, etc on Ebay / PayPal is meaningless, if their account has been comprisemised; the email verification thing you suggested is pointless because email is often how PayPal accounts get compremised - so it's likely the scammer would have no problem sending a "verification" email, etc.

Eva is right on about using a non-revocable payment method. Credit cards, checks / cashier checks, ACH, etc can all be easily reversed. Bank wire / escrow eliminates most all payment problems.

You've been lucky so far ... just because it's not happened to you doesn't mean it can't - outright scammers are easy to spot, but very difficult to spot when they're using someone else's account.

Ron

 

[Theo]

You miss the point. The point being, eBay offers coverage for any type of goods regardless of whether they are tangible or virtual - including domain names. eBay actually promotes Paypal as a recommended payment method. We're not examining the possibility of an account being compromised. If that's the basis of our conversation, I might actually be Ricky Martin.