legal Non-Paying DNForum member – after $40K offer at Afternic!

[Cartoonz]

Cartoonz & David,

You are being unfair gentlemen.

My employee placed the bid from his personal account not a company account.
- He was not authorized by the company to do so
- He is is not an executive director in the company
- He did, what he did in personal capacity.

Please advise me if I should be held responsible for the "unauthorized" actions of employees or associates.
I repeat: He did not use the company name, email or authorized account.

Now I know you are completely full of cr@p.
Read your own earlier statement:

Yodaj,

What you are saying is true.

My colleague did log-into the account and took the liberty to "fool around" not understanding the gravity of a legally binding offer.
While I cannot defend his behavior; I do sincerely apologise to you for the inconvenience caused.

As a long-standing DNF member let me assure you that this has never happened before and will not happen again.

Thanks.

So now you are completely changing your story, which is beyond ridiculous. Now you're trying to tell us not only did he "login from his separate personal computer" but that he did not even login to the company account to place the bid! Uhh... it is not exactly rocket science to see how that dog won't hunt... if what you just said was true - we would not be having this conversation! You already confirmed he used your account, so what you are saying now has to be a lie.

Zorro, you have escalated this from an already serious breach of trust to a whole new level of bad. And you have done that all by yourself with your own ricdiculously unbelievable statements. It's funny, in a way... kind of like handing a man a shovel to get himself out of a hole he is already in... yup, you are just digging a deeper hole for yourself. Why do I say this? Well, try to see what we are seeing... first you claim he logged into "the" account (obviously yours). and now you have the audacity to claim he never even used that account. Really? That tracks true for you?

What will you come up with next? Some street beggar you have no connection with whatsoever made a bogus bid from an internet cafe you've never visited from an account you've never heard of? Oh, and that the guy YOU are responsible for breaching the agreement with (it IS 'your' company, right?) should owe you an apology for outing your sorry @ss?

...who's got the popcorn?

 

[Zorro]

Unfortunately, I had to come back to this mental asylum and respond again. Hopefully for the last time.

We have an account with afterNIC that is used to buy & sell domains: our COMPANY account.
When I saw the seller's post here, I checked with my entire team (25 people) if a bid was actually placed and not honored. My designer owned up and apologized to me. I presumed it was from our company account. Came here and apologized to the seller because I thought it was the right thing to do. Hoping that this would be the end of the story.

Ofcourse the situation here continued to escalate because some gutless cowards take great pleasure in attacking at the slightest pretext. The seller was not willing to accept the apology either. At DNforum, if anybody throws dirt at you it is because you are guilty unless proven innocent.

After my first apology post I went back to investigate what actually happened with the account. NO BID WAS PLACED FROM IT.
The designer had created a personal account and placed a bid from it... a foolish act. He had NO AUTHORIZATION from the company to do so. The executive directors of the company were not in the know of his actions. He did what he did in personal capacity.
I tried to reason here with my next post but was wasting my time; this is an orchestrated drama to try and settle scores with actors doing their masters bidding.

My membership here and credibility for 11 years is worth shit at DNF. You need to suck up to *great visionaries* here to be be considered worthy of any credibility whatsoever.
New members here are definitely credible; especially when they are backed by twisted facts and have official endorsements.

Cartoonz: You are a *respected* senior member here. And a complete idiot. A reflection of the quality of the forum perhaps?
Seriouly man, why would you waste your time in running down somebody without having access to facts or evidence. You sound like a FBI reject.
And who made you the judge of anybody's credibility? Is the recession getting to you?

Theo: You dragged my company name into this on purpose. And the blog.
Nice team work.

Angel69: You need medical attention. Now.
When your treatment is complete please let me know when or how I attacked you before.


Yodaj: I apologised for the actions of my employee. But you dont want to let it go.
At first you sounded disappointed (understandble), later desperate and your recent messages are bordering on blackmail.

You want to tarnish our company's fair name and *expose us* via social media or whatever. I have no doubt that you will do it and there are many here who will be happy to help. Infact the process has started. When I find out who you represent (and I will) please be assured that you will be paid back in kind.

- And BTW I had to change our site information to reflect our legal holding. Everybody who has shares is a partner for us, not an executive director.

- If you think you have been wronged by the company, be man enough to initiate legal proceedings. You know that your case is on flimsy grounds; PROVE ME WRONG.

- One thing is for sure: If you keep sending me the same message over and over again:
"Pay up or else ..." my view about your expertise in blackmail will be confirmed.

***

From experience I know that this is not going to end here. So all you vultures can come out and enjoy yourself; if nothing else, it makes for great entertainment. Unfortunately at my expense!

For the few members who reached out and empathized with me: Thank You.
Hopefully sometime in the future, civility & decency in discussions will be enforced here.

Until then ... Im Outta Here

 

[angel69]

You got some nerve to call us "gutless cowards" ... the posts where I tried to empathize w/your dilemma and I was fair to you (which may have upset others) do not count in your book, eh ? You're an ingrate. And if someone needs to have his head examined it's you. I put my ass on the line for someone I did not even know (you) and even when against others I do know when I suggested a solution, did you even read my posts....? it could be your anger is blinding you, when did I "attack you" ? If anything I was conciliatory towards you when I made suggestions which you conveniently forgot about, I even went all out for you and stated that what happened to you could happen to anyone who's not careful about who accesses their PC and Afternic acct. The fact that your employee (under your responsibility) accessed the Afternic acct from whatever PC is damaging to you since he knew how to get into Afternic and place bids, he is all YOUR responsibility

I am not part of any concerted effort or plan to settle any score you may have from over a decade ago, I could not care less about that and if you think this is a vendetta from somebody against you, and that we're out to "destroy you", then it is you who needs a psychiatrist urgently. The people who posted referred to the facts that had come to light, we are not "actors" obeying some "master" who only exists in your head. And you tell me I'm crazy ?..... I don't suck up to anyone on DNF either, I respect Adam, admins and mods for the great job they do, but if they're ever mistaken I'll call them on that, your imagination and conspiracy theory have gotten the better of you, the facts aren't twisted, they are black and white. You should appreciate people taking the time to read your thread and take an interest in learning what happened so we may suggest a solution between Yodaj and your company, but being the ingrate that you are you can't appreciate this

Legal issues were raised on this thread and when someone under YOUR CONTROL (like it or not he was) placed that bid on behalf of your company. Whatever he did, whichever reasons he had, whichever PC he used, and no matter how you slice it, he placed that bid on behalf of YOUR company, and he put you/your company in hot water. You fail to admit that. Nobody is trying to "run you down", we base our opinions on the facts that have come out and on the things you yourself wrote in your own posts, you now sound paranoic as well if you read post #22

I think the comment you made about Adam, our host, was petty. That Adam and you had some type of disagreement or problem of some kind God knows how many years ago. And it is me who needs psychotherapy but not you ? The only conspiracy right now exists just in your head

Unfortunately, I had to come back to this mental asylum and respond again....... the situation here continued to escalate because some gutless cowards take great pleasure in attacking at the slightest pretext...... At DNforum, if anybody throws dirt at you it is because you are guilty unless proven innocent..... this is an orchestrated drama to try and settle scores with actors doing their masters bidding....... You need to suck up to *great visionaries* here to be be considered worthy of any credibility whatsoever......New members here are definitely credible; especially when they are backed by twisted facts and have official endorsements......

Cartoonz: You are a *respected* senior member here. And a complete idiot. A reflection of the quality of the forum perhaps? Seriouly man, why would you waste your time in running down somebody without having access to facts or evidence. You sound like a FBI reject. And who made you the judge of anybody's credibility? Is the recession getting to you?

Theo: You dragged my company name into this on purpose. And the blog. Nice team work.

Angel69: You need medical attention. Now. When your treatment is complete please let me know when or how I attacked you before.

Yodaj: I apologised for the actions of my employee. But you dont want to let it go. At first you sounded disappointed (understandble), later desperate and your recent messages are bordering on blackmail. You want to tarnish our company's fair name and *expose us* via social media or whatever. I have no doubt that you will do it and there are many here who will be happy to help..... So all you vultures can come out and enjoy yourself; if nothing else, it makes for great entertainment. Unfortunately at my expense! ......

 

[Magnatolia]

Legally, my understanding is that although the employee used company resources, if it was done in his own account then the company is not responsible. Although his actions should have him fired due to the fact that by using company resources he drags your name into things. That's why some big corporations don't allow their employees to access personal emails and/or make it very clear that whatever the employee visits, or whatever opinion they provide is not from the company.

Zorro, in terms of your first response it was weak. There was no acknowledgement that you would look into it. And if it was the company account that he had used then yes you would be responsible. But of course he doesn't want to let it go. It sounds like your employee got a slap on the wrist.

 

[amplify]

All I can say is that if you were a US based company and I had shares, I would pressure the directors to find a new CEO cause you're not the icing on the cake to lead a company.

 

[Eurorealtor]

Legal issues were raised on this thread and when someone under YOUR CONTROL (like it or not he was) placed that bid on behalf of your company. Whatever he did, whichever reasons he had, whichever PC he used, and no matter how you slice it, he placed that bid on behalf of YOUR company, and he put you/your company in hot water. You fail to admit that. Nobody is trying to "run you down", we base our opinions on the facts that have come out and on the things you yourself wrote in your own posts, you now sound paranoic as well if you read post #22

Agree here, Zorro mentioned the guy is a company shareholder representing the same company, unless he has separated personal account, "phishing" others from personal PC at home.
On the other hand blackmail emails or PMs from the OP is not the right way to fix the problem, if that is happening.
And by the way, newbies on a forum may not necessary be newbies in the industry.

 

[Theo]

Can the OP provide the communication he received from Afternic? That'd help clarify some things.

 

[chipmeade]

The op didn't lose the name and still owns it. A court will likely have a hard time making any kind of restitution because the only thing that was exchanged were promises. They will not likely compel the high bidder to purchase the name at the stated price. How is Afternic dealing with the tow separate accounts from the same company? If they are two separate accounts rather than 2 users from one account, they might be able to ban the one that bid and did not buy. At this point you are fighting a losing battle and you need to chalk it up to unethical/erroneous behavior by the bidder and move on. No need to get down into the dirt and make yourself even more angry. Good luck.

 

[Cartoonz]

Wait.. there's a conspiracy against you by some higher masters that we supposedly all serve? Hmmm... I don't recall getting that memo.

You yourself supplied the supposed "facts and evidence", and even an "idiot" can see the discrepancy between the two versions. Only now do you attempt to justify the vast differences between the two versions, which is strange in itself. The OP should be able to shed some light on the veracity of your latest version though, as Theo has suggested... what was the account info from Afternic?

Zorro, your personal attacks on me (and others) really make no sense at all. Nor do they change the situation you are in, other than perhaps actually making yourself look worse. Instead of wasting your own time and energy attacking people who are questioning your responsibility in this matter, you might have considered presenting the entire set of facts and evidence from the start. Had you done that, most of us would probably have just stayed silent. Instead, what you are doing seems to be an ever evolving "story" that conveniently distances you from any responsibility at all. Sure, what you are saying may well be true, but the manner in which you have elected to use to convey that information is what is causing your problems. THAT is what people are picking up on, and THAT is completely under your control. Conspiracies, 12yr old grudges, Lords and Masters, condescending name calling, space aliens, etc... that's not really going to help. But sure, continue down that road if you like, at least it provides some entertainment value... but it will certainly not make you look any more credible. Think about that a bit.

 

[DomainsInc]

Unfortunately, I had to come back to this mental asylum and respond again. Hopefully for the last time.

We have an account with afterNIC that is used to buy & sell domains: our COMPANY account.
When I saw the seller's post here, I checked with my entire team (25 people) if a bid was actually placed and not honored. My designer owned up and apologized to me. I presumed it was from our company account. Came here and apologized to the seller because I thought it was the right thing to do. Hoping that this would be the end of the story.

Ofcourse the situation here continued to escalate because some gutless cowards take great pleasure in attacking at the slightest pretext. The seller was not willing to accept the apology either. At DNforum, if anybody throws dirt at you it is because you are guilty unless proven innocent.

After my first apology post I went back to investigate what actually happened with the account. NO BID WAS PLACED FROM IT.
The designer had created a personal account and placed a bid from it... a foolish act. He had NO AUTHORIZATION from the company to do so. The executive directors of the company were not in the know of his actions. He did what he did in personal capacity.
I tried to reason here with my next post but was wasting my time; this is an orchestrated drama to try and settle scores with actors doing their masters bidding.

My membership here and credibility for 11 years is worth shit at DNF. You need to suck up to *great visionaries* here to be be considered worthy of any credibility whatsoever.
New members here are definitely credible; especially when they are backed by twisted facts and have official endorsements.

Cartoonz: You are a *respected* senior member here. And a complete idiot. A reflection of the quality of the forum perhaps?
Seriouly man, why would you waste your time in running down somebody without having access to facts or evidence. You sound like a FBI reject.
And who made you the judge of anybody's credibility? Is the recession getting to you?

Theo: You dragged my company name into this on purpose. And the blog.
Nice team work.

Angel69: You need medical attention. Now.
When your treatment is complete please let me know when or how I attacked you before.


Yodaj: I apologised for the actions of my employee. But you dont want to let it go.
At first you sounded disappointed (understandble), later desperate and your recent messages are bordering on blackmail.

You want to tarnish our company's fair name and *expose us* via social media or whatever. I have no doubt that you will do it and there are many here who will be happy to help. Infact the process has started. When I find out who you represent (and I will) please be assured that you will be paid back in kind.

- And BTW I had to change our site information to reflect our legal holding. Everybody who has shares is a partner for us, not an executive director.

- If you think you have been wronged by the company, be man enough to initiate legal proceedings. You know that your case is on flimsy grounds; PROVE ME WRONG.

- One thing is for sure: If you keep sending me the same message over and over again:
"Pay up or else ..." my view about your expertise in blackmail will be confirmed.

***

From experience I know that this is not going to end here. So all you vultures can come out and enjoy yourself; if nothing else, it makes for great entertainment. Unfortunately at my expense!

For the few members who reached out and empathized with me: Thank You.
Hopefully sometime in the future, civility & decency in discussions will be enforced here.

Until then ... Im Outta Here

i have no interest in attacking anyone and i'm sure most people feel the same. i just don't get why anyone would make a bid they knew they had no possibility of completing unless they purposely wanted to mess with the seller.

 

[Theo]

Theo: You dragged my company name into this on purpose. And the blog.
Nice team work.

"On purpose" - I've been a journalist since 1985; which is before you were born. Everyone here agrees that your employee/partner f*cked up and you need to make amends. B!tching because I did a 5 minute research to find out the name of the company, then acting like a baby leaving the forum after 10 years shows what is the real issue here: you don't like that the truth came out. I hope Afternic bans you.

 

[yodaj]

First- thanks for all the comments.


1. Theo- The address his PARTNER and I repeat Partner used was his company address. That is what was given to me. I did not deduct or assume anything. I will not post it yet, for reasons I will state later on in this post.

2. Zorro - You started out by apologizing. Don’t take it back now. You were starting to get on the right path, though adding in an ODD explanation, that your partner was "fooling around". Be a man and own up to your obligations. If you do- people will appreciate the fact that you made a mistake and correct it, rather than come up with different stories.

3. You asked the forum if they think you should be responsible for this by saying "Please advise me if I should be held responsible for the "unauthorized" actions of employees or associates." So now that people give you the answer that you should take responsibility for your partners action (whether done by your authorization or not), you decide to leave the forum? Why bother asking for their opinion if you have no plan of following it, if it is not the answer you will want to get?

4. As mentioned by Cartoonz, if this person had no connection to you or not done in capacity of your company… why did you apologize and explain the gravity of the situation to him…??
You could have said what you are claiming now that he did it on his own.

5. He may have not been authorized as you claim but he is a partner according to your site 5 days ago (irrelevant if he has stocks or not), and he did put in your company info when buying this name, and he did help build your domain market place. So he knows what he is doing.

6. Not only did you change the story you claimed at the beginning but you went out of your way to change the title of your partner on your website now that this came out.

7. So I find it quite a remarkable coincidence that you had to change the site info to reflect your "legal holding" in the last few days. You had the nerve to send me a PM stating that he was only " a ____ head and he is not well versed with the rules of business". I answered you that I had screen captures, and that the truth will eventually come out, if you don’t do something to rectify the situation.

8. You claim that I planned on exposing you and your company, threats, blackmail etc… LOL. If I wanted I would have exposed your company name at the beginning or in the later posts. Also others wouldn’t have approached you by email prior to my post. The one who is actually threatening here is you. I'm sorry. Who did something wrong here? Me or you/partner? I seem to be getting confused. You threaten to return the same favor to me(??)

9. I had also not exposed the name of your other companies, nor your name or that person's name. I am not out to get you or expose you. I was giving you the opportunity to do the right thing. I don’t know what you know about blackmail or threats but be assured a lawyer sees every post/PM I send. There is no threat and no blackmail. You own a domain market place. You CAN do better. You really think that it is OK to break a contract if done by your "worker", and I can't mention your name or the companies involved so others can hear what happened?? Are you kidding me?

10. I was being nice towards you. It's up to you- how this moves forward. As I said, to you, I have only had excellent experience with people from your country and believe this is just a "misunderstanding", and that it can be solved in a suitable way for all parties concerned.

 

[katherine]

The 'partner' may have acted in a personal capacity.
But that doesn't change the fact that he is associated with the company.
He may have registered a separate account at Afternic. Yet he used the corporate details in that account.

No matter how you look at it, the company cannot just ignore the embarrassment arising from the foolish actions of one partner, and sweep it under the rug.
No sane person would place a bid of $40,000 just to fool around, especially when that person works in a domain related outfit and should know better.
In this business, reputation is everything.

Zorro says he's not accountable. Alright. I'm fine with it.
Then perhaps the partner can post here and offer his side of the story ? Or better yet, get in touch with the OP directly and save public embarrassment that is unnecessary.
Somebody did mess up and should take responsibility.
The OP did nothing wrong.

That's it Zorro, perhaps you could tell your partner to come forward and make things right. It doesn't have to go like this.

 

[David G]

Why is we don't see the domain name posted in the thread? What's the big secret?

It's always possible the buyer made a dumb error and rather than own up to it claims he was just 'fooling around' Possibly the spelling is somehow different than the name he had in mind or some other issue such as he thought he was paying $400 not $40,000 i.e. the Dallas Cowboys who backed-out after thinking Cowboys.com was $275 not the actual auction price of $275,000! Maybe someone told him he over-paid and the name is only worth a fraction of 40k. If we know the domain we can eliminate those issues if it really looks like a 40k domain.

 

[Theo]

Maybe someone told him he over-paid and the name is only worth a fraction of 40k. If we know the domain we can eliminate those issues if it really looks like a 40k domain.

Buyer's remorse is not a valid (legal) reason to cancel a transaction. As the OP stated in his latest post, the buyer/buyer's boss/partner went to the extent of changing the web site to reflect a different business relationship. That ups the game to a whole different level. He should be banned on DNForum.

 

[David G]

Buyer's remorse is not a valid (legal) reason to cancel a transaction. As the OP stated in his latest post, the buyer/buyer's boss/partner went to the extent of changing the web site to reflect a different business relationship. That ups the game to a whole different level. He should be banned on DNForum.

Plead don't accuse me of thinking that's a good reason, it's not a valid reason. It's just that I don't understand why the domain is a secret and think it's possible an error may be why he backed-out. Didn't you also ask for the name is post #5?

 

[Theo]

It's just that I don't understand why the domain is a secret and think it's possible an error may be why he backed-out.

Other possibilities: He was drunk when he placed the bid. He was feeling 'frisky'. He thought it was 'fun'. It was just a test. He thought it wouldn't be a big deal.

 

[David G]

Other possibilities: He was drunk when he placed the bid. He was feeling 'frisky'. He thought it was 'fun'. It was just a test. He thought it wouldn't be a big deal.

If we knew the name and it turns out to be pidginn-shit.net and it's a dot-net plus a spelling error combined with a hyphen then we can at least realize it's true when he says he was just 'fooling around' or 'having fun'

 

[Theo]

If we knew the name and it turns out to be pidginn-shit.net and it's a dot-net plus a spelling error combined with a hyphen then we can at least realize it's true when he says he was just 'fooling around' or 'having fun'

Maybe he needs to be compensated then. He actually bought a name on Afternic that wasn't worth $40k. Not only he exposed the seller, he also proved how bad Afternic is by not paying! :lol:

 

[Cartoonz]

Why is we don't see the domain name posted in the thread? What's the big secret?

It's always possible the buyer made a dumb error and rather than own up to it claims he was just 'fooling around' Possibly the spelling is somehow different than the name he had in mind or some other issue such as he thought he was paying $400 not $40,000 i.e. the Dallas Cowboys who backed-out after thinking Cowboys.com was $275 not the actual auction price of $275,000! Maybe someone told him he over-paid and the name is only worth a fraction of 40k. If we know the domain we can eliminate those issues if it really looks like a 40k domain.

At this point, the domain name is irrelevant.
While I'm curious too, that's a red herring. All parties involved are well acquainted with domain values...