Partnercash.com sells for $110k ??

[Rubber Duck]

Yes, you are asking Main Street America to use Chinese!

Because, when Mary Jane in Peoria clicks on a link that looks like it belongs to an American company, she will really be going to phishers in China.

If phishing is a problem now, how will IDNs effect it? We all know it will make the problem MUCH worse.

MS was perhaps a poor example. MS could give a rat's ass about internet security most of the time. But, IDNs will likely prove a headache, even for MS.

IDNs have to die, because they are such a huge security risk. I don't know exactly how or when or where or by whom, but they will be killed off, or at least segregated from civilization. You have my permission to start a second internet just for IDNs.

If the goal is a single internet that is safe for e-commerce, IDNs don't play any role. Think about it; it CAN'T work.

Firefox have come up with a provision means of ensuring that such problems do not arise by displaying the Punycode domain in the address bar. Future browsers will no doubt provide warnings and options at installation to allow people to use the browser in safe mode if that is what they wish to do. The Chinese example was particularly ill-advised as no Chinese Characters closely resemble the Romanic Alphabet.

Even without IDN there are numberous ways of using hyperlinks to get the naive to the wrong website. The most common trick is simply to use the wrong TLD.

No amount of paranoia on behalf of the American public (even if you are not in a small minority) is going to have any significant impact on the development of IDN one way or another.

IDN on the contrary are essential for the development of e-commerce in much of the world. If the US wishes to take an isolationist policy on this, then perhaps they will have to take their ball home. I can't think of any other nation that would choose to isolate itself from the rest of the world, but I wouldn't put it past the US. If they do, who cares anyway, fortunately I am not based there.

Best Regards
Dave Wrixon

 

[JEsports]

MFR. HEAD

Hehehe, anyways ... An IDN keyboard huh ... and I thought they were trying to make the keyboard smaller and more compact. My thoughts are simple and rational being:

1) Just because you go and reg a bunch of number .com's doesnt mean that everyone will now go and access the internet all the time from there cellphone automatically converting numbers to generics, and blah blah blah. There are way too many damn websites people want to go to for a number system to ever work. Also, no one is going to give up a nice computer monitor for a small ass cellphone screen.

2) Just because you go and reg a bunch of "IDN's" doesnt mean that the future resides in converting these unrecognizable characters instead of people just typing it in. Sure go and buy some different nationally translations of popular keywords ... that makes sense that they will get typeins ... but this IDN stuff just doesnt make any sense logically or economically.

3) Just because you can access the internet from your television doesnt mean that everyone is going to do it now. This has been out for a quite a while, and if my wife came home and found me playing online poker on the television screen when she wants to watch Desparate Housewives or Super Nanny, guess how long i'll be in that tournament?

These are offcourse my personal opinions, and I did not claim to invent the internet. Im just throwing out some logistics to this madness.

 

[DaddyHalbucks]

Firefox have come up with a provision means of ensuring that such problems do not arise by displaying the Punycode domain in the address bar. Future browsers will no doubt provide warnings and options at installation to allow people to use the browser in safe mode if that is what they wish to do. The Chinese example was particularly ill-advised as no Chinese Characters closely resemble the Romanic Alphabet.

Even without IDN there are numberous ways of using hyperlinks to get the naive to the wrong website. The most common trick is simply to use the wrong TLD.

No amount of paranoia on behalf of the American public (even if you are not in a small minority) is going to have any significant impact on the development of IDN one way or another.

IDN on the contrary are essential for the development of e-commerce in much of the world. If the US wishes to take an isolationist policy on this, then perhaps they will have to take their ball home. I can't think of any other nation that would choose to isolate itself from the rest of the world, but I wouldn't put it past the US. If they do, who cares anyway, fortunately I am not based there.

Best Regards
Dave Wrixon

Mary is not a paranoid. She is a mother and a teacher.

Mary in Peoria doesn't know what a Punycode is --or even a browser bar. All she knows is her bank account was cleaned out because she did a transaction at a website that she thought was her bank.

Maybe her bank will file a class action lawsuit against the browser mfr.

The question is not whether the US wants to join the world. The question is whether the world wants to join the US internet. This seems like a "no brainer."

 

[Mr. Deleted]

So now the PardnerCash.com thread is a discussion of IDNs?

 

[JEsports]

PardnerCash.com

Hmmm..PardnerCash.com available to reg ... almost had to donate you 40 F bucks ... im sure someone will snag it.

 

[sasquatch]

Daddy you're completely missing the point. This is not about what domainers want, or whether poor Mary in Iowa was phished, but what American capitalism is missing. And American capitalism is missing enormously and greatly because it is not serving that market in localized manner (whether be it customers, or the suppliers that sell to those customers).

It is unbelievable not to envision a day when Chinese, Arabic and other potential billions of users will be served via local websites in their own linguistic characters.

For example, look at these sites:

chinachina.com
jdzmc.com
jdwww.online.jx.cn

Is that how hundreds of millions of Chinese customers should be looking for their products/content, by typing an English alphabet address in their browsers? I mean, if we take into account that 99% of Chinese don't speak a word of English, don't you realize what a wasted opportunities are these, even for the American companies, because the American companies will be the one who will be buying off these local businesses, and the american companies will be the ones who will be supplying something to them (whether the actual products, brains, expertise, technologies, marketing etc.)

Imagine how many millions of commercial websites can be made all over the world using the local characters? Everything from beer, to autos, to lingerie, to gambling all could (and I believe will be) served via local domains, because those domains are the only logical ways for most customers in those countries since they don't speak or write anything else. Imagine the role of american business and capital that will be needed to be provided in direct operation or support of all of this?

I don't understand why is this concept so "foreign" to some?

It is only matter or time, it's not if, but when.

 

[Mr. Deleted]

Hmmm..PardnerCash.com available to reg ... almost had to donate you 40 F bucks ... im sure someone will snag it.

lol, I mistyped it, but, like PartnerCash.com, it does not have OVT... Maybe it is worth 50K too?

 

[Rubber Duck]

1) Just because you go and reg a bunch of number .com's doesnt mean that everyone will now go and access the internet all the time from there cellphone automatically converting numbers to generics, and blah blah blah. There are way too many damn websites people want to go to for a number system to ever work. Also, no one is going to give up a nice computer monitor for a small ass cellphone screen.

NOT QUITE SURE ON THIS ONE BUT INTERESTING POINT ON INTERNET ACCESS. YOU DO REALISE OF COURSE WHILST ALL PHONES WILL HAVE NUMBERS THEY MAY NOT HAVE THE ENGLISH ALPHABET.

2) Just because you go and reg a bunch of "IDN's" doesnt mean that the future resides in converting these unrecognizable characters instead of people just typing it in. Sure go and buy some different nationally translations of popular keywords ... that makes sense that they will get typeins ... but this IDN stuff just doesnt make any sense logically or economically.

APPEARS YOU ARE INTENT ON CONTRADICTING YOURSELF. IF YOU HAVE ARABIC OR CYRILLIC KEYBOARD, HOW EASY IS IT GOING TO BE TO TYPE IN DOMAINS THAT COMPRISE UNIQUELY OF ENGLISH ALPHABET CHARACTERS.

3) Just because you can access the internet from your television doesnt mean that everyone is going to do it now. This has been out for a quite a while, and if my wife came home and found me playing online poker on the television screen when she wants to watch Desparate Housewives or Super Nanny, guess how long i'll be in that tournament?

ACCESSING THE INTERNET VIA THE TELEVISION IS NOT AN IDEA THAT EVER OCCURRED TO ME. YOU ARE OBVIOUSLY WAY AHEAD OF ME ON THIS.

These are offcourse my personal opinions, and I did not claim to invent the internet. Im just throwing out some logistics to this madness.

OR INDEED A SPANNER INTO THE WORKS?

BEST REGARDS
DAVE WRIXON

Mary is not a paranoid. She is a mother and a teacher.

Mary in Peoria doesn't know what a Punycode is --or even a browser bar. All she knows is her bank account was cleaned out because she did a transaction at a website that she thought was her bank.

Maybe her bank will file a class action lawsuit against the browser mfr.

The question is not whether the US wants to join the world. The question is whether the world wants to join the US internet. This seems like a "no brainer."

Daddy,

The internet is not an American asset. The body that excercises control over the Internt allbeit with tactit approval of the US government has already implemented all that it needs to make IDNs work. At DNS level IDN is a reality.

If the US wants to back off now. Then as far as I am concerned, once I have found somewhere else to register and host my domains, it can pull the plug. Mind you might have to go over dot US as I am not sure the main TLDs would still work on your bit!

Best Regards
Dave Wrixon

 

[JEsports]

Dave ... I will say one thing to you and leave it at this because I am not going to get in a huge ridiculous argument over the validity of IDN's with you ... Nor am i going to try to explain that web tv has been out "unsuccessfully" for some time now. These other points i was making, are just in reference to other peoples ideas of "the future of the internet" ... and offcourse are my own personal "spanning" opinion as you like to call it.

So what i have to say to you is: "Good luck with your theories"

 

[Rubber Duck]

Dave ... I will say one thing to you and leave it at this because I am not going to get in a huge ridiculous argument over the validity of IDN's with you ... Nor am i going to try to explain that web tv has been out "unsuccessfully" for some time now. These other points i was making, are just in reference to other peoples ideas of "the future of the internet" ... and offcourse are my own personal "spanning" opinion as you like to call it.

So what i have to say to you is: "Good luck with your theories"

Thanks for your contributions. Obviously, this is all a bit of fun really, but I must admit some of the more extreme views put here do get me going at time. Do you think Daddyhalbrucks is serious, or is he just winding me up? :cheeky:

 

[DaddyHalbucks]

Daddy,

The internet is not an American asset. The body that excercises control over the Internt allbeit with tactit approval of the US government has already implemented all that it needs to make IDNs work. At DNS level IDN is a reality.

If the US wants to back off now. Then as far as I am concerned, once I have found somewhere else to register and host my domains, it can pull the plug. Mind you might have to go over dot US as I am not sure the main TLDs would still work on your bit!

Best Regards
Dave Wrixon

The internet is very much an American asset, although our share is gradually being diluted.

IDns are not compatible with our existing internet; sure, they may be TECHNICALLY compatible, but they are not practically compatible.

Osborne, Cray, Netscape, Borland, Data General, many others had good technology. Where are they today?

The beauty of the internet is that it allows a single standard of communication. How is IDN compatible with that? Security is becoming more important, not less.

Maybe someone will devise a way to solve the security problems of IDNs. But until then, IDNs are dead as far as I can see.

 

[LuckYou]

that s luck...!!

 

[sasquatch]

IDNs are dead as far as I can see.

Maybe that's precisely your problem? Maybe you just don't seem to see that far? :clown:

Telling me that one day billions of people around the world won't be able to access the internet in their native language just because Mary from Peoria got scammed once is ridiculous. Telling me that American capitalists won't throw themselves to dominate and support those huge and virgin international markets is terribly naive at best.

Now, that is as far as I can see (bah)

The beauty of the internet is that it allows a single standard of communication.

Hihi, 50% of Miami doesn't speak English, and you want to make those gazillions on the net do so??

Your dreams are of epic proportions.

 

[DaddyHalbucks]

Maybe that's precisely your problem? Maybe you just don't seem to see that far? :clown:

Telling me that one day billions of people around the world won't be able to access the internet in their native language just because Mary from Peoria got scammed once is ridiculous. Telling me that American capitalists won't throw themselves to dominate and support those huge and virgin international markets is terribly naive at best.

Now, that is as far as I can see (bah)

Could be. Maybe you will be my Daddy someday. It's all possible. I don't have all the answers. While a large problem, it's certainly not insurmountable.

One Mary in Peoria didn't get scammed --a hundred thousand Marys got swindled.

Your basic argument (as I understand it) is that: the convenience of web surfers in foreign countries to use the net in their native language, not merely to read native text on webpages, which is relatively easy and already done, but also in the more esoteric area of domain navigation --will trump the internet security needs of the US. And, some domain speculators will get rich in the process.

It's a wonderful dream for the owners of the IDNs, but as a business plan, I don't know. It will be interesting to see how IDNs play out..

 

[sasquatch]

Your basic argument (as I understand it) is that: the convenience of web surfers in foreign countries to use the net in their native language, not merely to read native text on webpages, which is relatively easy and already done, but also in the more esoteric area of domain navigation --will trump the internet security needs of the US. And, some domain speculators will get rich in the process.

No. My basic argument is not that at all. In fact I bended backwards to explain that this is not about creating convenience for the "international web surfers" for sake of creating convenience or some sort of U.N. type idea, but about being ready to serve consumption needs of those potential zillions net users in emerging economies. It is about American companies creating false needs in local markets around the world (in the same way they did here). Followed by supplying those needs with American (or American owned) products, expertise, intelligence, ideological ideas, values, interests. It's about American companies extorting money in various different ways from the zillions-strong local population. It's about taking local populace in American led/owned direction. It is about blending in "with the crowd" in localized non-openly hostile manner, and dominating them "from within".

It's a wonderful dream for the owners of the IDNs, but as a business plan, I don't know. It will be interesting to see how IDNs play out..

I personally don't have a single IDN name, yet I'm a big believer in IDN idea. This is a bit contradictory, but it is simply because I also believe that the meaningful IDN implementation might not happen for years until that developing world catches up to more Western-levels of internet access presence, and until Internet becomes a household word/"thing" in China and India and places like that.

Do I believe that IDN names will be worth much in five years?
No.

Do I believe that Korea, China, India, Russia, Iran etc. will access the net in their own language (if they chose so) in 5-15 years?
Definitely!

 

[DaddyHalbucks]

No. My basic argument is not that at all. In fact I bended backwards to explain that this is not about creating convenience for the "international web surfers" for sake of creating convenience or some sort of U.N. type idea, but about being ready to serve consumption needs of those zillions net users in emerging economies. It is about American companies creating false needs in local markets around the world (in the same way they did here). Followed by supplying those needs with American (or American owned) products, expertise, intelligence, ideological ideas, values, interests. It's about American companies extorting money in various different ways from the zillions-strong local population. It's about taking local populace in American led/owned direction.

I read that and even re-read it, but I am still not sure what you are trying to say!

 

[sasquatch]

I read that and even re-read it, but I am still not sure what you are trying to say!

Well, what can I say man.

Do you want me to write you a diagram?

 

[financialtraffic]

Hmm, what's that quote again..."The language of business is English."

And don't blame me, I'm multilingual.

But it does have some truth. Most of the major players are companies targeting customers who can at least type some English -- enough to get to a .Com site. Then, once they are there, translation of pages are a breeze.

Why would IDNs ever become more than a tool for .Com owners to get international users to their site? I don't think they will ever be the prime domains.

No. My basic argument is not that at all. In fact I bended backwards to explain that this is not about creating convenience for the "international web surfers" for sake of creating convenience or some sort of U.N. type idea, but about being ready to serve consumption needs of those zillions net users in emerging economies. It is about American companies creating false needs in local markets around the world (in the same way they did here). Followed by supplying those needs with American (or American owned) products, expertise, intelligence, ideological ideas, values, interests. It's about American companies extorting money in various different ways from the zillions-strong local population. It's about taking local populace in American led/owned direction.




I personally don't have a single IDN name, yet I'm a big believer. This is a bit contradictory, but it is simply because I also believe that the meaningful IDN implementation might not happen for years until that developing world catches up to more Western-levels of internet access presence, and until Internet becomes a household word/"thing" in China and India and places like that.

Do I believe that IDN names will be worth much in five years?
No.

Do I believe that China, India, Russia, Iran etc. will access the net in their own language (if they chose so) in 5-15 years?
Definitely!

 

[sasquatch]

Most of the major players are companies targeting customers who can at least type some English

My point is why would companies want to target only that extremly select, minor, tiny percentage of users in places like China for example, when they could target everybody who can write Chinese?

Of 100% audience who are locally literate why would you target only 0.000001% (who understand english aphabet) when you can target those 99.99999% (who understand local characters)?

My goodness, we are sweating buckets here claiming that nothing other than .com is worth developing because we lose audience/customers when they type in .com, instead of .net (or what have you), but we are totally cool with the idea that is perfectly acceptable (from a business point of view) to target only those few who understand English, instead of targeting all of them who understand local?

Our own thinking makes no sense, now does it?

 

[DaddyHalbucks]

Hmm, what's that quote again..."The language of business is English."

Why would IDNs ever become more than a tool for .Com owners to get international users to their site? I don't think they will ever be the prime domains.

Yes. English is the new lingua franca.

I don't think .COM owners will want use IDNs to get international users. Heck, companies have been slow to even use generic .COMs to acquire US customers.

IDNs allow scamsters to steal customers, and companies don't want that. Companies don't want to bother to think up and register every possible IDN domain which might be a security hole. Think about it, each company has to devise its own IDN security strategy? That makes no sense.

It is far easier to have corporate America tell the browser mfrs, or the networks, or ICANN "block all IDNs."